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Old 01-07-2013, 05:34 PM
 
1,601 posts, read 2,121,172 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by filihok View Post
This goes back to my point about social mores that no one seems willing to touch.

The reason that mores exist is so that society can function without having to question a person's every action. We know what an action is supposed to mean.

However, since the conditions under which these (men paying, etc) mores were formed no longer exist, the more's themselves are breaking down. Thus, instead of simplifying our interactions, they are confusing them. The mores need to change.
And how would you suggest going about changing mores, across the board?
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Old 01-07-2013, 05:38 PM
 
Location: Up in the air
19,112 posts, read 30,501,365 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by filihok View Post
Couple questions

What happened after that interaction, when he said he thought you weren't interested? Couldn't the spark have been rekindled at that point?

Did you not communicated during the date? You paid but did you hint at, or, gasp, even flat out state, that you'd like to see him again?




This goes back to my point about social mores that no one seems willing to touch.

The reason that mores exist is so that society can function without having to question a person's every action. We know what an action is supposed to mean.

However, since the conditions under which these (men paying, etc) mores were formed no longer exist, the more's themselves are breaking down. Thus, instead of simplifying our interactions, they are confusing them. The mores need to change.
He already had a girlfriend at that point. One that, I'm sure, he paid 100% for on each date.

Yes, it was very obvious that I was into him considering I specifically told him I'd like to see him again. He said he thought I was 'letting him down nicely'.
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Old 01-07-2013, 05:39 PM
 
2,028 posts, read 1,878,914 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JetJockey View Post
Nope. My best guy friend maintains that if a woman pays on the first date or argues over the check she doesn't want to be 'in debt' to the guy and therefore isn't interested in seeing him again.

I know this has happened to me on two separate occasions, and possibly a few more that I'm not aware of. One of the guy was really confused, because I saw him a few weeks after our date and asked him why he didn't call...he said he thought I wasn't interested because I wanted to split the bill.

Thus is my life
JetJockey,

This seems like an issue that can be resolved with good communication. How could he possibly go home without knowing you're interested? Maybe saying something like this when they try to pay, with a smile: "I am really enjoying my time with you and would love to see you again. I just prefer to be fair to you and pay my share of the bill."

Or, "I like you, don't worry you don't have to pay for me."

If they persist after that point and try to pressure you later because they paid, just firmly remind them they insisted over and over and you only allowed them to pay to keep the peace. If they don't see the logic in that, they're idiots.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JetJockey
Yes, it was very obvious that I was into him considering I specifically told him I'd like to see him again. He said he thought I was 'letting him down nicely'.
Ahhh, good ole misunderstandings. Some of us guys can be so dense with signals. Did you wait for him to call or did you call him after the date?
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Old 01-07-2013, 05:41 PM
 
2,028 posts, read 1,878,914 times
Reputation: 1001
Quote:
Originally Posted by filihok View Post
Couple questions

What happened after that interaction, when he said he thought you weren't interested? Couldn't the spark have been rekindled at that point?

Did you not communicated during the date? You paid but did you hint at, or, gasp, even flat out state, that you'd like to see him again?

This goes back to my point about social mores that no one seems willing to touch.

The reason that mores exist is so that society can function without having to question a person's every action. We know what an action is supposed to mean.

However, since the conditions under which these (men paying, etc) mores were formed no longer exist, the more's themselves are breaking down. Thus, instead of simplifying our interactions, they are confusing them. The mores need to change.
I'm enjoying the logic of you posts in this thread, and I enjoyed the Socratic method. I wish JetJockey didn't see them as condescending because this method can be quite helpful at bringing others to their own revelations.
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Old 01-07-2013, 05:42 PM
 
Location: Up in the air
19,112 posts, read 30,501,365 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Freedom123 View Post
JetJockey,

This seems like an issue that can be resolved with good communication. How could he possibly go home without knowing you're interested? Maybe saying something like this when they try to pay, with a smile: "I am really enjoying my time with you and would love to see you again. I just prefer to be fair to you and pay my share of the bill."

Or, "I like you, don't worry you don't have to pay for me."

If they persist after that point and try to pressure you later because they paid, just firmly remind them they insisted over and over and you only allowed them to pay to keep the peace. If they don't see the logic in that, they're idiots.
Maybe he was an idiot? I have no idea. We were paying in cash, I laid down my share +tip (I actually ended up paying more than he did) and he didn't say a thing about it. We were walking back to our cars and I gave him a hug, kiss on the cheek and said 'I had fun, I'd like to see you again sometime.'

How could that be misconstrued?
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Old 01-07-2013, 05:42 PM
 
Location: State of Transition
101,986 posts, read 106,584,071 times
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Jet, maybe it was an excuse. Maybe he just wasn't into you, and put up this pretense. ...?
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Old 01-07-2013, 05:44 PM
 
Location: State of Transition
101,986 posts, read 106,584,071 times
Reputation: 115667
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freedom123 View Post
I'm enjoying the logic of you posts in this thread, and I enjoyed the Socratic method. I wish JetJockey didn't see them as condescending because this method can be quite helpful at bringing others to their own revelations.
The odd thing about it was, though, that Jet Jockey was in agreement with him from the start. She wasn't the one who needed convincing.
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Old 01-07-2013, 05:45 PM
 
Location: Up in the air
19,112 posts, read 30,501,365 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
Jet, maybe it was an excuse. Maybe he just wasn't into you, and put up this pretense. ...?
That's what I was thinking....but he seemed honestly shocked when I talked to him a few weeks later. I mean, it's not like I've never been rejected before
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Old 01-07-2013, 05:48 PM
 
Location: Albuquerque, NM
13,290 posts, read 15,204,451 times
Reputation: 6657
Quote:
Originally Posted by tazzled View Post
And how would you suggest going about changing mores, across the board?
1) The same way the developed. Over time and by trial and error seeing what works, and what doesn't.

2) By rational, thoughtful people 'spreading the word'


Quote:
Originally Posted by JetJockey View Post
He already had a girlfriend at that point.
After a few weeks?

He might not have been that into you
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Old 01-07-2013, 05:50 PM
 
2,560 posts, read 2,628,265 times
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I don't pay on dates as my mindset is 'the one asking is the one paying' and since guys ask me...

In my opinion how long into dating do gals start paying is sort of like how long into dating do guys start having sex with her while having feelings for her not just lust. In other words it's quite a stretch of time.
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