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Yes. It IS evidence. But what is the evidence telling us? If you have one example that might serve to conform to evidence that God exists, and thousands of examples that are consistent with a God who is entirely made up and never existed to begin with, what valid conclusions are to be made?
The question then becomes, should we draw our conclusions based solely on impartial statistical analysis of the total of examples, or do we simply ignore the overwhelming majority of the "evidence" that does not conform to the desired conclusion, and only consider as valid the small minority of examples which conform to the desired conclusion?
What we have here is a perfect encapsulation of the vast difference between empirical science and religious belief.
I believe in God, and I even believe in miracles and that God worked miracles long before Jesus came along, but what is presented here as evidence just turns out to be evidence against Jesus in my opinion. I think it takes away from the truth, I think it damages Christianity everytime somebody tries to present something like this as evidence for the power of the Holy spirit. It may have well been a miracle, and it may have well been God, but what it is not, is a miracle from prayer. It may have been a miracle, but not one single person can stand up to take credit for recieving answered prayer. Not one Christian can make the case that he has any power at all. Millions can claim to have power but there isn't a single person who has any power.
In reality, we have an epidemic of posters saying they "have proof"...on both sides of the aisle. I've seen little proof in this whole subforum.
its partially do due people selectively weighting observations to suit personal options. people tend to shy away from eliminating claims based on "more/less likely". or the ever present cop outs are deployed.
I believe in God, and I even believe in miracles and that God worked miracles long before Jesus came along, but what is presented here as evidence just turns out to be evidence against Jesus in my opinion. I think it takes away from the truth, I think it damages Christianity everytime somebody tries to present something like this as evidence for the power of the Holy spirit. It may have well been a miracle, and it may have well been God, but what it is not, is a miracle from prayer. It may have been a miracle, but not one single person can stand up to take credit for receiving answered prayer. Not one Christian can make the case that he has any power at all.
Millions can claim to have power but there isn't a single person who has any power.
Wonderful guts to state your belief so clearly ...I mean where you could be mocked or
attacked... Good for you!
In reality, we have an epidemic of posters saying they "have proof"...
on both sides of the aisle. I've seen little proof in this whole subforum.
I would like to say...I have no proof of anything! On another forum where they let
you have a signature ...
I state , " I have no scientific proof of anything I say"!
But, I never say anything that I have not exp'd or I say "(I have read that from 10 authors...and tend to believe it, it rings true to me..)." Like I would never say, "Jesus healed that girl"...why would I even think that?
NOW, if he came to someone and said, "I healed that little girl's tumor." I would like to talk to that person. OR if the little girl said Jesus came to her....fascinating....or maybe Gabriel!
Now that would make headlines, "Gabriel came to me at 3 am and said he would heal me."
Do I believe Jesus could intervene and heal someone? Yes.
I would be more likely to say God or the Holy Spirit healed that person.
Why do I say that, because I am in awe of the power the spiritual realms have....whether an angel, the Holy Spirit or my Father directly...I have experienced
what would be called supernatural power several times over decades....too many to even
question that it comes from another place...the Intelligent Unseen.
In reality, we have an epidemic of posters saying they "have proof"...on both sides of the aisle. I've seen little proof in this whole subforum.
In my opinion, whoever claims he has proof that God exists then his faith is in question.
And whoever claims he has proof that God does not exist also lives in hallucination.
If there was a proof that God exists then all world would’ve been turned into believers.
And if there was a proof that God does not exist then all world would have been turned into Atheists by now.
I am a believer in the existence of God by faith. And I don’t need any proof.
And if another person brings me a proof that God exists then I will probably play the role of devil’s advocate, and dismiss and shatter his proof into pieces. And I don’t think it will be a hard job to do.
Last edited by GoCardinals; 12-21-2018 at 08:36 PM..
It is evidence. Another log of evidence to throw on the big pile.
Fairy rings in your lawn are evidence of fairies, if you believe in fairies but it's not verifiable evidence and that is the only kind of evidence that matters if one is searching for truth.
Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi
No. It isn't evidence. It's just your opinion.
And by the way, if you think I didn't argue against "the ridiculous claim that a dead missionary proves there is no Jesus", then you didn't read the thread. I got into an extended argument about just that.
That's Jeff all over. Read it (sometimes), ignore it - and then claim it didn't happen. He's been like it from day 1.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoCardinals
If there was a proof that God exists then all world would’ve been turned into believers. And if there was a proof that God does not exist then all world would have been turned into Atheists by now.
Not exactly. You fail to take into account those believers who, even when presented with verifiable evidence, still prefer to believe on 'faith'.
Quote:
I am a believer in the existence of God by faith. And I don’t need any proof.
You seem to think that is a good thing. Can you explain why there is not one other thing in your daily life where you use faith rather than evidence when questioning whether or not something is true?
Quote:
And if another person brings me a proof that God exists then I will probably play the role of devil’s advocate, and dismiss and shatter his proof into pieces.
I would like to say...I have no proof of anything! On another forum where they let
you have a signature ...
I state , " I have no scientific proof of anything I say"!
But, I never say anything that I have not exp'd or I say "(I have read that from 10 authors...and tend to believe it, it rings true to me..)." Like I would never say, "Jesus healed that girl"...why would I even think that?
NOW, if he came to someone and said, "I healed that little girl's tumor." I would like to talk to that person. OR if the little girl said Jesus came to her....fascinating....or maybe Gabriel!
Now that would make headlines, "Gabriel came to me at 3 am and said he would heal me."
Do I believe Jesus could intervene and heal someone? Yes.
I would be more likely to say God or the Holy Spirit healed that person.
Why do I say that, because I am in awe of the power the spiritual realms have....whether an angel, the Holy Spirit or my Father directly...I have experienced
what would be called supernatural power several times over decades....too many to even
question that it comes from another place...the Intelligent Unseen.
I know you know this. people that post alot seem to have an axe to grind. even me.
look at how they attack such a simple claim that we are surrounded by life and people sense it. The claim fits exactly what we see going on, it fits exactly what you think you feel, and it matches what we know. they won't face it down and it always gets back to "yeah, their god isn't real", lmao, talk about straw of an ass to ride.
ant-belief is their base axiom, not how the universe works. most, be them believers or not, are not out to heal us all. They are out to push personal agenda and take their "perceived" due.
i think you have guts too miss h. you are way to gooshy for me, but you lay out it out. I snicker, but I also will not "get out of their so they can have at you" either.
In my opinion, whoever claims he has proof that God exists then his faith is in question.
And whoever claims he has proof that God does not exist also lives in hallucination.
If there was a proof that God exists then all world would’ve been turned into believers.
And if there was a proof that God does not exist then all world would have been turned into Atheists by now.
I am a believer in the existence of God by faith. And I don’t need any proof.
And if another person brings me a proof that God exists then I will probably play the role of devil’s advocate, and dismiss and shatter his proof into pieces. And I don’t think it will be a hard job to do.
Do you see the problem we have with "... I am a believer in the existence of God by faith. And I don’t need any proof...."
why not be apologetic in nature?
apologetics gets a bad name, but if you look at who deployed it, it becomes clear that they are only atheist fundy sects. Apologetics just means, in a simple form, change a belief based on "data".
can you list some traits of your god that matches the standard model?
i think you have guts too miss h. you are way to gooshy for me, but you lay out it out. I snicker, but I also will not "get out of their so they can have at you" either.
Thanks, really.
I understand, I am gooshy....you can't believe what goes on in my heart....oops I'll stop.
And I wish religious folks would stop with there hellfire and 'you must believe
their way'...utter nonsense...each has his own Path. Everyone is in their perfect place for them and
should be content as they are....if not, change something when you want to.
Whatever floats your boat, I say.
...I have experienced
what would be called supernatural power several times over decades....too many to even
question that it comes from another place...the Intelligent Unseen.
So have I, I just haven't healed anyone, but yeah, supernatural power that I and my family witnessed but nobody would believe it, only my family believe because they saw it and experienced what happened to me.
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On another forum where they let
OR if the little girl said Jesus came to her....fascinating....or maybe Gabriel!
