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The library site is an interesting one. It will have access from both Academy and Harrison, but with single-family homes directly abutting the site, any development will have to be sensitive to that. And with there now being discussions of moving the Ivey-Ellington to that site (and presumably needing to give it some room to breathe), there are definitely challenges for redevelopment.
I honestly don't see how the bulk of an expanded community center would work on that site. The acreage of the town's assemblage there is three times that of the Mayton Inn site, but obviously the bulk would be much larger if you're trying to build a gymnasium or two with very high ceilings.
The library site is an interesting one. It will have access from both Academy and Harrison, but with single-family homes directly abutting the site, any development will have to be sensitive to that. And with there now being discussions of moving the Ivey-Ellington to that site (and presumably needing to give it some room to breathe), there are definitely challenges for redevelopment.
I honestly don't see how the bulk of an expanded community center would work on that site. The acreage of the town's assemblage there is three times that of the Mayton Inn site, but obviously the bulk would be much larger if you're trying to build a gymnasium or two with very high ceilings.
I didn't realize that the old library site included the two parcels facing Harrison behind the library as well.
I think the town could easily put the Ivey-Ellington facing Harrison and a community center facing Academy.
The Old Library site and the Herbert C. Young community center site are each about 3 acres. When you think of this as a downtown project, this is actually quite a lot of land.
A building similar in scale to the Alexander YMCA on Hillsborough Street would occupy about 1/3 the total library site, and would be entirely appropriate in scale and bulk for Academy Street. The Alexander Y sits on 3.5 acres including its parking lot, and at about 74k square ft, is roughly triple the size of the 25ksf Herbert C Young center. To do this while also including the Ivey-Ellington house *and* on site parking might require a two-level parking structure, which I don't think would be a big impediment. Alternatively they could just have people use spaces in the deck at the park across the street.
For some perspective, the 301 Hillsborough Street development in downtown Raleigh occupies about 2 1/4 acres. This development is proposed to have three towers roughly 20 stories tall, and a total of about 1 million square feet. The Nexus development also downtown, sits on about 3.25 acres, and will have four towers, also around 20 stories each, and about 1.5 million square feet of total floor area.
Now, as much as I would like to see it happen, I don't think that something that size is quite feasible in Cary, unfortunately. But I do think something as big as maybe 10 or 12 stories could *possibly* happen on the Community Center site: current zoning for that site already allows buildings 90 feet tall (which could be a 9 story apartment building) and that number seems pretty arbitrary; town council is fairly pro-development at the moment and it might be possible to get some extra height. On the other hand, I doubt anything more than 3 or 4 stories would ever see the light of day at the Old Library site. Enough for a fantastic community center? You bet. But for a big mixed use development? Doubt it.
Alexander YMCA with its parking is about 4.5 acres, plus another acre for the picnic shelter/open space. Could something like Alexander fit on the old library site? Perhaps, although parking would definitely be an issue...Alexander has about 220 spaces.
Would it happen given the desired scale for Academy St. and other constraints? I have significant doubts.
I'm pretty sure Ivey-Ellington would front Academy Street for historical prominence. It could be situated in front of the rest of the development, as the lot is plenty wide to still allow access and maybe even some frontage for the rest of the project on Academy.
I really don't think a new community center is on the town's radar though. With a $112 million bond for parks now on the books, that'll be the focus for a good many years.
There's also a growing trend of mega indoor sports complexes/event centers that I wonder if Cary might be interested in getting in on at some point, particularly if the situation at WakeMed Park changes. Rocky Mount just opened a 165,000 square foot one with a flexible design to accommodate 8 basketball or 16 volleyball courts, including the ability to transform part of it into a featured court with seating for 4000. There are also meeting rooms, a cafe, and a family entertainment area. Henrico County outside Richmond is also looking at building a 200,000 square foot one. Obviously the mix of uses could be tailored for Cary's needs, but combining a draw for amateur sports tournaments with everyday amenities for residents might be an interesting idea.
A new community center is definitely on the Town's radar. Several individuals I have contacted at the town about this have alluded to searching for a site, hoping to have some concrete plan in place within the next 6-8 months. You are right that it wasn't a part of the bond, so it may be a part of the regular capital budget.
Why does Ivey-Ellington need to be on Academy? To me it looks hokey where it is on Chatham between two commercial developments, and would be more of the same on Academy which is becoming increasingly commercial. Harrison is a prominent street too, and predominately residential at that- so this house would look right at home there.
As for parking, the town just completed a huge deck 500 feet from here. If that isn't enough, incorporate a 2-3 level precast parking structure at the center of the library site, with the community center facing Academy, and Ivey-Ellington facing Harrison.
I don't know what Cary's vision for using Ivey-Ellington is, but of course the southern portion of Academy is lined with former residential homes that have largely been converted to commercial, and I think Ivey-Ellington would fit right in as a small yet prominent piece of Cary's main street.
I agree that its current location is not good, although it's more than just the location that detracts...it sits back from the street, not quite square to Chatham, the house itself is unused for anything, and the grounds are in poor shape.
I still think that the library site is close enough to single-family homes that the town will limit the intensity of use in the redevelopment, but maybe I'm wrong.
I see where Cary submitted a proposal for a 250,000(!) Square foot multi sport facility near Fenton, etc. under a RFI for county hospitality and tourism development tax funds. I agree that if this is the direction the town is taking, a predominately athletic facility probably does not make sense downtown.
There are other uses supported by community centers such as classrooms, ballrooms, meeting rooms, and gathering space, for programs not necessarily related to competitive sports. Probably less than half of the Herb Young Center is the gym. Some of this need for space is filled by the Arts Center but there's plenty of need for more.
Not sure whether continued discussion of this should go here or in a CTC thread, but since it started here I'll keep it here. Cary's was the only proposal to Wake County for the proposed indoor multipurpose facility. From this week's town manager report:
Quote:
Multipurpose Indoor Sports Complex
Congratulations to staff for successfully submitting a proposal to Wake County for hotel occupancy funding for the future Multipurpose Indoor Sports Complex to be located at Cary Towne Center. We just learned that our proposal was the only one submitted for this funding. The next step is a presentation of our proposal to Wake County on January 23.
They've proposed two location options, right next to each other on the Cary Towne Center redevelopment site. Option 1 is right at the corner of Walnut and Maynard, while Option 2 is the next block down along Walnut.
Option 1 is interesting because it includes the current gas station site at that corner. It's given the CTC folks some difficulty trying to plan for connectivity, intersection widening, etc. without controlling that tiny property. I've long thought it would be ideal if it could be acquired and added to the redevelopment, so looks like that's still a possibility.
$193 million project, with $35 million proposed to come from the county food/beverage/occupancy tax and the rest from the town. Construction would start summer 2022 and it would open summer 2024.
The proposal mention bonds to pay for this. I am guessing this would mean a new bond referendum, not sucking up most (all?) of the funds from the 2019 parks bond?
I am not quite sure about your statement of $35.5 million outside support with everything else coming from the town. $157.5 million is an enormous amount for the residents of Cary to bear, for what is supposed to be a regional facility.
I see in the proposal that the town has explicitly promised $82.5 million of its own money. The remaining $110.5 million is listed as "Town of Cary with Interlocal Support". Not sure what that means, I hope it means some other county-level funding eg. from the Wake County Parks and Recreation's facilities budget is on the table.
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