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Romans 3:23 - For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
Romans 3:23 refers to personal sin, not original sin - there is a huge difference.
Original sin is not anything anyone of us chooses to do, we just inherit it at birth as part of mankind.
Personal sin requires a conscious effort to do something we know is wrong and goes against God.
As a human being Mary did inherit original sin so she did understand herself to be a "sinner", which is why we hear her say "My soul rejoices in God my savior" in Luke 1:47.
But Mary was "saved" from personal sin, and in a most unusual manner. She was given special grace which saved her from ever committing even the slightest transgression.
And yes, Sacred Scripture backs this up when it tells us that salvation can also refer to man being protected from sinning before the fact:
Jude 24-25 "Now to him who is able to keep you from falling and to present you without blemish before the presence of his glory with rejoicing, to the only God, our Savior through Jesus Christ our Lord, be glory, majesty, dominion, and authority, before all time and now and for ever."
Romans 3:23 refers to personal sin, not original sin - there is a huge difference.
Original sin is not anything anyone of us chooses to do, we just inherit it at birth as part of mankind.
Personal sin requires a conscious effort to do something we know is wrong and goes against God.
As a human being Mary did inherit original sin so she did understand herself to be a "sinner", which is why we hear her say "My soul rejoices in God my savior" in Luke 1:47.
But Mary was "saved" from personal sin, and in a most unusual manner. She was given special grace which saved her from ever committing even the slightest transgression.
And yes, Sacred Scripture backs this up when it tells us that salvation can also refer to man being protected from sinning before the fact:
Jude 24-25 "Now to him who is able to keep you from falling and to present you without blemish before the presence of his glory with rejoicing, to the only God, our Savior through Jesus Christ our Lord, be glory, majesty, dominion, and authority, before all time and now and for ever."
You are right. Thank you. Wow so fun to learn. But I still don't like the idea of praying to any one but God.
But that is a opinion not doctrine.
Again thank you for explaining. The Holy Spirit showed me with Jeremiah.
You are right. Thank you. Wow so fun to learn. But I still don't like the idea of praying to any one but God.
But that is a opinion not doctrine.
Again thank you for explaining. The Holy Spirit showed me with Jeremiah.
Cool
If you could perhaps look at prayer as "communication" and not just "worship" maybe it would make more sense to you why some of us talk to Mary or the other saints
Mary WAS BORN WITHOUT ORIGINAL SIN that is why she is called the "Immaculate Conception", She is called that name among other names. If you think about it she has to be a pure vessel for Christ to grow in her womb. Christ could not be surrounded by sin in the womb.
People who are Sola Scriptura will argue until the cows come home because they won't match Mary to what Scripture says. Only scholars who study the bible will tell us what it means. Like when the Angel appeared to Mary to tell her she was to be Christ's mother he said she was "full of grace" which meant she was without sin. Mary knew what that meant even if she didn't know about the fact she was born without original sin, the angel knew. Scholars later knew what it meant.
Mary WAS BORN WITHOUT ORIGINAL SIN that is why she is called the "Immaculate Conception", She is called that name among other names. If you think about it she has to be a pure vessel for Christ to grow in her womb. Christ could not be surrounded by sin in the womb.
People who are Sola Scriptura will argue until the cows come home because they won't match Mary to what Scripture says. Only scholars who study the bible will tell us what it means. Like when the Angel appeared to Mary to tell her she was to be Christ's mother he said she was "full of grace" which meant she was without sin. Mary knew what that meant even if she didn't know about the fact she was born without original sin, the angel knew. Scholars later knew what it meant.
Oh boy janelle, you made me realize I misphrased my sentence above It's too late to edit now so let me correct it here...
As a human being Mary did NOT inherit original sin by virtue of her "immaculate conception". But she did not understand this herself and thought of herself as a "sinner" like any other person. This is why we hear her say "My soul rejoices in God my savior" in Luke 1:47.
Apologies, long day, typing too fast before I had to rush off to the next thing
As a human being Mary did NOT inherit original sin by virtue of her "immaculate conception". But she did not understand this herself and thought of herself as a "sinner" like any other person. This is why we hear her say "My soul rejoices in God my savior" in Luke 1:47.
The Catholic answer (Catholics always have answers ) is that Mary was saved at the moment of conception by a special intervention of God. She was saved from Original Sin just like everyone else.
Of course Catholic answers are never that short. Here is a long version.
Oh boy janelle, you made me realize I misphrased my sentence above It's too late to edit now so let me correct it here...
As a human being Mary did NOT inherit original sin by virtue of her "immaculate conception". But she did not understand this herself and thought of herself as a "sinner" like any other person. This is why we hear her say "My soul rejoices in God my savior" in Luke 1:47.
Apologies, long day, typing too fast before I had to rush off to the next thing
Absolutely. As the scripture explains the temple as the body. I posted earlier about the prophet Jeremiah.
God sanctified him in the womb. Which means to make Holy. Being ordained a prophet is a vessel for the WORD
of GOD. And like a prophet Mary was ordained to be a vessel for the WORD of GOD incarnate.
This I see now.
2 Corinthians 6:16
What agreement is there between the temple of God and idols? For we are the temple of the living God. As God has said: "I will live with them and walk among them, and I will be their God, and they will be my people."
3. any person or thing regarded with blind admiration, adoration, or devotion:
What I have seen among those who do not understand much about God in the catholic congregation blindly pray to saints, mary, and angels. The best way I can describe why I disagree is with the visual of a scale.
On one side you pray to the Father, and on the other is other. So why not get rid of the Scale as is in revelation and pray only to the Father.
What happens to those that dont understand this teaching of praying to Mary. It will be a stumblingblock.
Rom ch 14
21 It is good neither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor any thing whereby thy brother stumbleth, or is offended, or is made weak.
22 Hast thou faith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he that condemneth not himself in that thing which he alloweth.
23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.
This might be a little deep. But meat is a reference to the depth of worship.
What I have seen among those who do not understand much about God in the catholic congregation blindly pray to saints, mary, and angels.
Saying Catholics don't understand much about God and saying they are "blindly" praying is a rude comment. It's also not true. Unless the Catholics you've seen were especially clueless human beings.
How much time have you spent praying with Catholics? Are you in Mass with them? How much time have you spent discussing the faith with actual, practicing Catholics?
Last edited by DewDropInn; 09-25-2014 at 10:32 AM..
Saying Catholics don't understand much about God and saying they are "blindly" praying is a rude comment. It's also not true. Unless the Catholics you've seen were especially clueless human beings.
How much time have you spent praying with Catholics? Are you in Mass with them? How much time have you spent discussing the faith with actual, practicing Catholics?
I have many catholic friends. we discuss our beliefs all the time. One did not know what a saint was. And still is confused. I tried to explain the RCC has patron saints. And I tried to explain that all followers of Christ are Saints. Another Spent his prayers and worship on angels. I have come to reconcile what I have seen in the world.
Its time to start fixing things.
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Too bad we don't have programs like this on TV anymore
