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Of course there are many translations today that now deny the orginal Bible. And that is why Scripture tell us the time would come when men would not endure sound doctrine, but would turn away from the truth and listen to fables. This was predicted, and was to be expected. And as Matthew 25:46 points out.
They will go away to (ETERNAL PUNISHMENT), but the righteous to eternal life.
How do you know that the translations of eternal torment that you believe in are not the ones that, as you say, were "predicted, and to be expected"?
How do you know that the translations of eternal torment that you believe in are not the ones that, as you say, were "predicted, and to be expected"?
Because at the sametime the statement was made. Eternal torment was believed, and taught in the Scriptures. The change that came was a denial of eternal torment many years later. Yet Jesus taught in Matthew 25:41.
Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the (ETERNAL FIRE) prepared for the devil and his angels.
The departure we see from eternal torment, is a new teaching, and a departure from the teachings of Christ.
Because at the sametime the statement was made. Eternal torment was believed, and taught in the Scriptures. The change that came was a denial of eternal torment many years later. Yet Jesus taught in Matthew 25:41.
Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the (ETERNAL FIRE) prepared for the devil and his angels.
The departure we see from eternal torment, is a new teaching, and a departure from the teachings of Christ.
Sooner or later everyone is going to learn that it was not even possible for them to not start trusting in Jesus as their Savior when they did start trusting in Him.
Until then, many will remain under the delusion that their cooperation with God was a product of their superior ability to make the smartest choice.
It isn't the 'smartest choice' to be made. I believe God draws us at the same time, He is using the Word and the Law to draw us towards Him, and then the Spirit convicts us. We all are missing a key ingredient to be at one with the Father. His Name is Jesus Christ.
There is no 'superior ability' or the 'smartest choice'. These are words of your mind, not mine.
Try humbling yourself before God, and quit listening to men. They are definately leading you astray, and not into the Truth. There is no 'cooperation with God' either. Either He is YOUR GOD, or He is NOT. God shows no partiality. God just IS.
There are no early translations that would suggest otherwise.
But don't you see. You're using translations to prove your assumptions. How do you know that your translation is faithful to the original Hebrew and Greek manuscripts?
Also, if you try to demonstrate that many believed in eternal torment, how are you going to prove that Jesus actually taught it? There have always been those within the covenant of Grace who have believed in God who justifies the ungodly (Rom 4:5), and there will always be those who believe they are justified by their own doings. All you're really able to tell us is what you believe and what is in your heart, not necessarily what Jesus taught. One thing that Jesus did tell us is that a good person brings forth good things.
Mat 12:35 A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil things.
Do you believe eternal torment is a good thing or an evil thing?
And if God does not love us, then how does he feel about us? There is only one answer for that question.
Why do you insist it is all about you? Kinda self centered isn't it? It is ALL about Jesus, His Son. Either you are IN Jesus, or you are not.
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Jesus said that anyone who does not love their enemies is no better than a sinner, so then if Jesus was right about that, and you are right about the idea that God does not love his enemies, then God is no better than a sinner. Is that really what you want to confess to believe?
Nice play on words, but it sounds like you need a biblical understanding of who and what God actually is.
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We were all at one time enemies of God.
The carnality was at emnity with God because of the fall.
For He Himself is our peace, who made both groups into one and broke down the barrier of the dividing wall, by abolishing in His flesh the enmity, which is the Law of commandments contained in ordinances, so that in Himself He might make the two into one new man, thus establishing peace, and might reconcile them both in one body to God through the cross, by it having put to death the enmity.
So, either you believe we are enemies of God, and MAYBE reconciled by Jesus, who is our peace,,,or you do not. You cannot have it both ways. You preach a false doctrine, because you believe that there is peace upon death for the non believer.
Therefore remember that formerly you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called "Uncircumcision" by the so-called "Circumcision," performed in the flesh by human hands—that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world.
But now in Christ Jesus you who formerly were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.
Who is brought near? Who is Paul writing to?
To the saints who are at Ephesus and faithful in Christ Jesus
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Oh yeah, the pharisees were all about how God loves all people, and will have all people to be saved right ...
No, they believed their works would save them,,,along with their words. Kinda like you all.
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Just keep teaching that God does not love his enemies ... If that is what you want to believe, then so be it ... Whatever a person believes in their heart, so are they.
It doesn't matter what I believe. It matters what the Word says. Try researching the word emnity.
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You have made it perfectly clear what you believe ... And God will deal with you in due time ... Just like the rest of us.
And I stand by it, because the Word says so. Try refuting the Word instead of me. I am but a man,,,but the Word endures forever. Here is a verse for you if you can handle it:
You adulteresses, do you not know that friendship with the world is hostility(echthra=emnity=hatred) toward God? Therefore whoever wishes to be a friend of the world makes himself an enemy(echthros=hated, odious, hateful) of God.
Wanton disregard of the scriptures is always a telltale sign of a false teaching.
A practical test for understanding truth is whether it has a universal application, as in, "All the inhabitants will learn righteousness because all have fallen short."
Because at the sametime the statement was made. Eternal torment was believed, and taught in the Scriptures. The change that came was a denial of eternal torment many years later. Yet Jesus taught in Matthew 25:41.
Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the (ETERNAL FIRE) prepared for the devil and his angels.
The departure we see from eternal torment, is a new teaching, and a departure from the teachings of Christ.
The vast majority of Christians in the first five centuries did not believe in eternal hell. As a matter of FACT, the vast majority of Christians in the first five centuries believed and taught Universal Salvation ...
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The Schaff-Herzog Encyclopedia of Religious Knowledge, vol. 12, p. 96; Retrieved April 29, 2007. “In the Westthis doctrine had fewer adherents and was never accepted by the Church at large. In the first five or six centuries of Christianity there were six theological schools, of which four (Alexandria, Antioch, Caesarea, and Edessa, or Nisibis) were Universalist; one (Ephesus) accepted conditional mortality; one (Carthage or Rome) taught endless punishment of the wicked.”
* Seymour, Charles. A Theodicy of Hell. p. 25. Springer (2000).
* Ludlow, Morwenna. Universal Salvation: eschatology in the thought of Gregory of Nyssa and Karl Rahner. Pp. 1-2. Oxford University Press (2000)
The simple fact is in the East, where Christians spoke koine Greek as their native tongue, universal salvation was the prevailing doctrine for the first five centuries and was taught by four of the six Catechetical schools in that time.
However, in the west, where the people spoke Latin as their native tongue, Eternal Torment was the prevailing doctrine ... It was only after the ken-slayer Constantine(who murdered his mother brother and sister) made Christianity the state religion of Rome that the western teachings of Eternal Torment became the orthodox teaching of the roman Catholic church, and all those in the east who taught Universal Salvation were declared heretics and persecuted and murdered.
You know why most of the Christians in the east who spoke koine Greek as their native language did not believe in eternal torment? Because the Greek scriptures do not teach it. It was only after Jerome translated the Greek scriptures into Latin in the Vulgate that the concept of eternal Torment entered into the scriptures because of his erroneous translations.
A practical test for understanding truth is whether it has a universal application, as in, "All the inhabitants will learn righteousness because all have fallen short."
Isaiah? Yes, during judgment people will see their error, but it will be too late.
PS it does not use the word "all", and it continues : "But when grace is shown to the wicked, they do not learn righteousness; even in a land of uprightness they go on doing evil and do not regard the majesty of the LORD"
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