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The scripture says the "lake of fire" is a place of torment day and night, it says not one word of being a place of "refining dross out of your Spirit!"
That is a fabrication of the UR!
Charlie, the Lake of fire will be a place of anguish for you, while you learn what is right.
People are just people, whether they claim Christianity or not. Or just religion in general not necessarily Christianity. Look what horrendous things have been done over the centuries in the name of religion. And it will never end. Times have changed. People have not. There's always been good and bad, and for some strange reason the bad believe they are good. There are no good "Christians" only good people, religion really has nothing to do with it.
My grandparents were very good people but they were strangled by the rules of Christianity and were basically in a cult. It's not normal to isolate yourself and your family from others because they are all evil except you and your particular brand of nonsense believers. It's just not.
So Mystic, what you witnessed was probably lip service and phoniness but in reality it's all a facade. Wife beaters, gamblers, thieves, drunkards....you never know what is behind those closed doors. I've found that all people, Christian or not, are judgmental and hypocritical, there are no exceptions (in the South anyway, bless your heart). No matter what their mouths are saying, it's just human nature to judge and be judged, but sorry, there is no god to answer to so it's a colossal waste of time to be religious.
Perfection is unattainable, I wish my grandparents hadn't wasted their entire lives worshipping something that isn't even real. I'll take a rude, imperfect Christian over an overbearing blow-hard hardcore Christian any day. As long as they are open about who they are and humble, then that is acceptable to me. The whole point of Christianity was to give people something to hope for and look forward to, but it's turned into wars and rumours of wars. Just because Christians can't agree.
I guess what I'm very clearly not communicating properly is that there never were any loving self-proclaimed Christians to be missed. There are some very nice, loving, caring individuals who do not ever talk about their religion or lack thereof, it's just in their nature to be good and kind. I really am not bashing Christians, but I do believe that religion is the greatest hoax of all time. It obviously is very effective to control the masses and that was the goal of past religious leaders, scare everyone to death with the eternal hell nonsense so they would fall in line.
I mean, COME ON! That was then, this is now. Christians say that the fact that the bible has survived over the centuries is in and of itself a miracle, but everyone and their brother, whether you're religious or not, probably has a copy of a bible somewhere in their home. Of course it survived. It's been preserved and protected for 1000's of years....not a miracle.
Hope you find your kind, decent and loving Christians Mystic. Sending good thoughts from this curmudgeon atheist.
Then they should not accuse those who have a diffetent view about God or not believing in theitr God as hating God. That is attempts to make it personal.
Anyone on the first time at this forum who not view the Christains posring here being loving.
well I cannot speak for others BL but I don't believe I have ever said any Christian hated God and as you are an atheist you do not believe in God so how can anyone accuse you of hating someone you do not believe exist?
People are just people, whether they claim Christianity or not. Or just religion in general not necessarily Christianity. Look what horrendous things have been done over the centuries in the name of religion. And it will never end. Times have changed. People have not. There's always been good and bad, and for some strange reason the bad believe they are good. There are no good "Christians" only good people, religion really has nothing to do with it.
My grandparents were very good people but they were strangled by the rules of Christianity and were basically in a cult. It's not normal to isolate yourself and your family from others because they are all evil except you and your particular brand of nonsense believers. It's just not.
So Mystic, what you witnessed was probably lip service and phoniness but in reality it's all a facade. Wife beaters, gamblers, thieves, drunkards....you never know what is behind those closed doors. I've found that all people, Christian or not, are judgmental and hypocritical, there are no exceptions (in the South anyway, bless your heart). No matter what their mouths are saying, it's just human nature to judge and be judged, but sorry, there is no god to answer to so it's a colossal waste of time to be religious.
Perfection is unattainable, I wish my grandparents hadn't wasted their entire lives worshipping something that isn't even real. I'll take a rude, imperfect Christian over an overbearing blow-hard hardcore Christian any day. As long as they are open about who they are and humble, then that is acceptable to me. The whole point of Christianity was to give people something to hope for and look forward to, but it's turned into wars and rumours of wars. Just because Christians can't agree.
I guess what I'm very clearly not communicating properly is that there never were any loving self-proclaimed Christians to be missed. There are some very nice, loving, caring individuals who do not ever talk about their religion or lack thereof, it's just in their nature to be good and kind. I really am not bashing Christians, but I do believe that religion is the greatest hoax of all time. It obviously is very effective to control the masses and that was the goal of past religious leaders, scare everyone to death with the eternal hell nonsense so they would fall in line.
I mean, COME ON! That was then, this is now. Christians say that the fact that the bible has survived over the centuries is in and of itself a miracle, but everyone and their brother, whether you're religious or not, probably has a copy of a bible somewhere in their home. Of course it survived. It's been preserved and protected for 1000's of years....not a miracle.
Hope you find your kind, decent and loving Christians Mystic. Sending good thoughts from this curmudgeon atheist.
The good thoughts are appreciated, NorthSouth! They are almost as good as prayers. Take good care of yourself out there, that darn Delta variant is more contagious than the original.
No, not in other words. As I've said, faith is not a meritorious work by which you can earn or merit salvation. Faith is simply the means by which the salvation which is being offered is taken possession of. A gift which is offered must be taken hold of by the one to which it is being offered. Someone hands something to you but you must reach out and take what is being handed to you.
I will never buy into that Calvinistic theology which you have lifted from Calvinism.
I did a thread on the fact that faith precedes regeneration back in 2010.
Jesus didn't say ''He who has been saved will believe in Me.'' He said ''He who believes in Him (speaking of himself) will have eternal life.'' John 6:40. The order is believe first (have faith) and then eternal life.
Besides Ephesians 2:8 Paul put belief first which results in salvation in Acts 16:31.
And in Romans 10:10 righteousness results from believing and salvation results from confessing. In Romans 10:14-15 belief (faith) comes by hearing the Gospel as I have been saying.
Mike did you help your parents when you were being born? An unborn child cannot have faith/belief in God until after they are born, thy do not know their father until after birth takes place.
the dead cannot know life until they have been resurrected.
what you believe is the old man can believe in God which is simply not scriptural, the old man must be destroyed because it is the old man that will never believe or have faith in God.
Your offer/gift nonsense does not apply to what Christ accomplished. It cannot be undone and it was for the entire human species. Whether or not we believe it and take full advantage of it is the only consideration that involves our receipt of the gift. It is more like someone saving your life without your permission. Your life is still saved and what you do about it is your only concern.
For the salvation to do you any good you must respond to it. I do not deny that, but you are saved whether or not you take advantage of it. The consequences for not taking advantage of it are not likely to be pleasant! But saved you are anyway!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD
Wrong again, Jimmie. We have to take advantage of our salvation by trying to love God and each other every day and repent when we fail. That is NOT "nothing"! But that has no effect on our salvation, just what we make of it.
Yes faith allows us to run in the race but one cannot run in the race until one has been born to run.
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Take good care of yourself out there, that darn Delta variant is more contagious than the original.
