Quote:
Originally Posted by MissKate12
Can you provide specific Scriptures? I find debating without book, chapter and verse to be a waste of time. If you have an opinion, then support it with God's word, otherwise, it is simply your opinion.
|
I can do that, but it will be long and tedious you may not find it acceptable if you believe our ancestors' primitive interpretations were correct. They were terrified of Spirits, they did not have the knowledge of the brain we have today and were too carnal-minded to understand being born again as a Spirit.
Baptism and the Water of Life
Baptism is a symbolic representation of the actual process within our brain that strengthens our eternal soul throughout life by denial of our selfish urges. It results in our rebirth as Spirit upon our death. Jesus explained this rebirth to Nicodemus. Nicodemus asked: "How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born again?" Jesus answered,
John 3:4
. . . I say to thee, unless a man be born again of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is Spirit. Do not wonder that I said to thee, 'You must be born again.'
In this remarkable passage from John, the word Water has major significance. It is clear from the many references to it, that ordinary water is not what is meant here, since it is actually within each of us. There are many mentions of this internal water of life,
John 7:38,
. . . He who believes in me, as the scripture says, ' From within him there shall flow rivers of living water.'
John 4:13
. . . He, however, who drinks of the water that I will give him shall never thirst; but the water that I will give him shall become in him a fountain of water, springing up unto life everlasting.
This water of life within us that relates to our ability to achieve rebirth refers to the fluid surrounding our brain. It is truly a water of life. However, at the time of Christ and John the Baptist, this was not exactly common knowledge. It still isn't very well known.
There is a standard pattern to human cognitive learning and the acceptance of new ideas. There must be at each new departure, a connecting link with previous knowledge or experience. Our means of achieving eternal life consists of self-control of our selfish urges through "immersion" into the water-like fluid surrounding our brain.
Our primitive ancestors could only produce a simple introduction to this concept . . . probably using the link with the birth water that precedes our physical birth. For the primitives of John's day, immersion into river water and the rebirth that was symbolized by it set the basic concept firmly in the memory of the species.
John the Baptist's teaching of baptism by water was simply our first primitive introduction to the concept and the methodology of rebirth. His task was to pave the way for future understanding.
John 1:26,
. . . I baptize with water; but in the midst of you there stood one whom you do not know. He it is who is to come after me, who has been set above me, the strap of whose sandal I am not worthy to loose.
John 1:31,
. . . And I did not know him. But that he may be known to Israel, for this reason have I come baptising with water.
and John 1:33,
. . . And I did not know him. But he who sent me to baptise with water said to me, 'He upon whom thou wilt see the Spirit descending, and abiding upon him, he it is who baptises with the Holy Spirit.'
Since one's attitude and one's spirit are really synonyms this basic idea would make it easier to accept and understand the true method once human knowledge progressed enough to have sufficient information about our brain, its functions, and its environment consisting of the water of life.
To discern the essentials of the actual process that is involved we need additional clues,
Revelation 22:1,
. . . And He showed me a river of the water of life, clear as crystal, coming forth from the throne of God. . . And He who was on the throne said . . . To him who thirsts I will give of the fountain of the water of life freely.
He who overcomes shall possess these things, and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
Basically, we know that mental activity is a process of energy change. Our brain cells transmute energy into thoughts. We do not know what happens to energy in the form of thoughts, but the fluid around the brain and neurotransmitters are intricately involved. Apparently, there is some electrochemical energy transmutation involving neurotransmitters when our consciousness interacts with our inner urges or basic drives ("He who overcomes"). The interaction produces changes in the composition of the water of life around our brain.
That should be sufficient to suggest that the kind of self-control we achieve throughout life is the source for the changes in this Water of Life within us otherwise we would never change our emotional age. This development (or lack thereof) has obvious implications for the fate that awaits our soul. It is entirely plausible that the energy of our soul (the source of our emotional maturity) is transformed by a specific type of mental activity and ion transfer in the fluid surrounding our brain.
A direct relationship between emotional maturity, mental health, depression, etc., and the composition of the fluid around the brain has been clearly established. Our emotional age normally increases for most of us as we mature. It is determined by and determines our level of self-control over our emotions and it is related to the composition of the fluid around our brain.
Some research conducted with severely emotionally retarded patients and this fluid around the brain provides potential insights into this connection. Altering the fluid around their brains has produced startling, if only temporary, increases in their emotional age. The fact that the changes were only temporary and could not be maintained without external supplementation.
Apparently, the composition of the fluid must be changed by internal mental processes. The good news is that temporary supplementation can create a more suitable environment for the brain to perform the actual mental processes of self-control that might eventually make the supplementation unnecessary. This is of course barring any actual congenital or disease factors.
John 3:5-8 King James Version (KJV)
5Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
8The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
No one still alive in their physical body has been "born again" as spirit. That requires our physical death and rebirth.
1st Corinthians 15:35-36 King James Version
35 But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come?
36 Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:
So what does the phrase "born again" actually refer to. It refers to being "conceived from above" (conceived by God). Conception is NOT birth as any woman knows.
Greek Word Studies: Born (begotten, father of, conceived) (1080)(gennao)
(gennao from genos = offspring, in turn from ginomai = to become) means to beget, to generate.
To beget Is spoken of men (Mt 1:2-16), whereas to bear is spoken of women. The passive voice means to be begotten. gennaō ek theos " begotten of God" gennaō anōthen (begotten from above, from a higher place, of things which come from heaven or God)"born again" anagennaō "born again" gennaō ek pneuma "born of Spirit"
The most notable uses of gennao are in the description of Jesus' virgin birth in which He was "conceived (gennao) in her (Mary) of the Holy Spirit." (Mt 1:20). He is described as "begotten (gennao)." (Acts 13:33).
1 John 4:7-8 King James Version
7 Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God.
8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.
1 John 2:29 (King James Version)
29If ye know that he is righteous, ye know that every one that doeth righteousness is born of him.
1 John 3:7 (King James Version)
7Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
1 John 3:9 (King James Version)
9Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
1 John 4:7 (King James Version)
7Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God.
1 John 4:7-8 Dear friends, let us love one another, for love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God. 8 Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.
1 John 3:18 Dear children, let us not love with words or tongue but with actions and in truth.
These are such perfect verses for highlighting the importance of ACTIONS. It also highlights the meaning of "born of God" that is confused with "born again" (anagennaō) or "born from above" (gennaō anōthen). "Born of God" is gennaō ek theos or "begotten of God" which means "to be conceived by God" as a spiritual embryo.
Spiritual embryos must mature sufficiently to be born. It is our actions in "love of God and each other" through our lives that achieve that spiritual maturation and determines what we have "built upon the foundation of Jesus"(wood, hay, stubble or gold, silver, etc.)This is what those who call themselves "born again" while still in the flesh are actually referring to.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
