Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > World Forums > Europe
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 12-13-2019, 05:46 PM
 
26,777 posts, read 22,529,485 times
Reputation: 10037

Advertisements

So as Paris negotiations brought no solutions to Donbass dilemma and next decisions have been pushed into March, Ukraine ( yet again) asked the US to intervene into the Nord Stream 2 project and to not allow to complete it, since Ukraine still hopes that Russia will be forces to ship gas via Ukraine, thus paying transit fees and ( possibly) supplying Ukraine with energy as well.

"Ukraine has lobbied Washington to pass the bill, as the pipeline would deprive the country of more than $2 billion in transit fees."

"Republican Senator Ted Cruz, one of the co-sponsors of the bill, has said that only a few companies in the world have the technology to lay deep-sea pipelines and none of them are Russian, meaning the Kremlin could struggle to complete the project should the foreign companies obey the U.S. sanctions bill."


https://oilprice.com/Energy/Natural-...-Pipeline.html

"On Monday, US legislators took a decisive step towards making that threat a reality, when the US House and Senate armed services committees voted to approve a defence bill that would force the Trump administration to sanction companies if they help Gazprom, the Russian state-owned gas company, complete the pipeline."


Needless to say, that the project with cost of over 9 billion euros, (and which was over 90% complete,) involved a number of European companies - German, Dutch, Italian, Austrian, which made it an EU problem.

"Joachim Pfeiffer, a member of parliament for Angela Merkel’s Christian Democratic Union, called on Germany and Europe to prepare countermeasures should the US move ahead with the planned sanctions."

https://www.ft.com/content/a1678124-...f-cc63de1d73f4


"The EU joined in criticising proposed US action.
EU Trade Commissioner Phil Hogan said Brussels “opposes the imposition of sanctions against any EU companies conducting legitimate business”.
“The (European) Commission objective has always been to ensure that Nord Stream operates in a very transparent and in a non-discriminatory way with the appropriate degree of oversight,” he said."


"Germany’s Schepp said the sanctions would end up affecting European companies more than Russia.
Half of the project is financed by Russian gas giant Gazprom, with the rest covered by its European partners: Germany’s Wintershall and Uniper, Anglo-Dutch Shell, France’s Engie and Austria’s OMV."

https://www.euractiv.com/section/ene...nord-stream-2/


It probably helps to keep all this in mind, before the next development of events concerning Ukraine will take place, and before anyone will blame Trump in "worsening of relations with our allies in Europe."
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 12-13-2019, 06:00 PM
 
9,511 posts, read 5,435,134 times
Reputation: 9092
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
So as Paris negotiations brought no solutions to Donbass dilemma and next decisions have been pushed into March, Ukraine ( yet again) asked the US to intervene into the Nord Stream 2 project and to not allow to complete it, since Ukraine still hopes that Russia will be forces to ship gas via Ukraine, thus paying transit fees and ( possibly) supplying Ukraine with energy as well.

"Ukraine has lobbied Washington to pass the bill, as the pipeline would deprive the country of more than $2 billion in transit fees."

"Republican Senator Ted Cruz, one of the co-sponsors of the bill, has said that only a few companies in the world have the technology to lay deep-sea pipelines and none of them are Russian, meaning the Kremlin could struggle to complete the project should the foreign companies obey the U.S. sanctions bill."


https://oilprice.com/Energy/Natural-...-Pipeline.html

"On Monday, US legislators took a decisive step towards making that threat a reality, when the US House and Senate armed services committees voted to approve a defence bill that would force the Trump administration to sanction companies if they help Gazprom, the Russian state-owned gas company, complete the pipeline."


Needless to say, that the project with cost of over 9 billion euros, (and which was over 90% complete,) involved a number of European companies - German, Dutch, Italian, Austrian, which made it an EU problem.

"Joachim Pfeiffer, a member of parliament for Angela Merkel’s Christian Democratic Union, called on Germany and Europe to prepare countermeasures should the US move ahead with the planned sanctions."

https://www.ft.com/content/a1678124-...f-cc63de1d73f4

"Germany’s Schepp said the sanctions would end up affecting European companies more than Russia.
Half of the project is financed by Russian gas giant Gazprom, with the rest covered by its European partners: Germany’s Wintershall and Uniper, Anglo-Dutch Shell, France’s Engie and Austria’s OMV."
https://www.euractiv.com/section/ene...nord-stream-2/


It probably helps to keep all this in mind, before the next development of events concerning Ukraine will take place, and before anyone will blame Trump in "worsening of relations with our allies in Europe."
The US can pass whatever they want. Europe is beginning to see the light. Nordstream will not be stopped. The companies involved will function just fine under sanctions, if money is an issue then they will just go a different route. There's more than one way to get it. Parts and technology? It can all be had elsewhere if any of it is needed. Some of those companies may lose business but i doubt it. Russia can build it's own equipment if it needs too. Technology for laying things on the bottom of the ocean has been around for better than 150 years. It's not hard to do either.

Just another step for the US on its chosen path to irrelevance. Ukraine can suck it if it doesn't want to deal with Russia.

Something else may be afoot though.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-17-2019, 09:16 PM
 
Location: Russia
1,348 posts, read 624,065 times
Reputation: 688
Protests in Kyiv over allowing the sale of Ukraine's prized farmland
https://www.euronews.com/2019/12/17/...ine-s-farmland

I don’t hear the groans and wringing of hands from the "progressive world community" about the "unreasonable use of force" by the police "of the tyrant" Zelensky.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-17-2019, 11:14 PM
 
26,777 posts, read 22,529,485 times
Reputation: 10037
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zimogor View Post
Protests in Kyiv over allowing the sale of Ukraine's prized farmland
https://www.euronews.com/2019/12/17/...ine-s-farmland

I don’t hear the groans and wringing of hands from the "progressive world community" about the "unreasonable use of force" by the police "of the tyrant" Zelensky.

It was all too predictable - the reaction that would follow in response to the "land reforms" demanded by the IMF/Soros. ( DKM was trying to explain here, how Ukrainians were "looking forward to the faster pace of reforms," while Poroshenko was "losing his popularity," because he, presumably, was "not moving fast enough" with those reforms.")


Ughhm.




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92PtKSN1Qqw


In other news from Ukraine - I wanted to mention the continuous "decommunization" of Ukraine, with removal of all the monuments commemorating Soviet commanders of the WWII and replacement of them with monuments devoted to Nazi collaborators ( those guilty of extermination of Jews including.)
But I decided not to bother, but then judging by the news Israel took note of all that, and then today I hear yet another scandal took place somewhere in Spain, where the fans of whatever Spanish club were chanting to one of the Ukrainian players that he was a Nazi, and the judges were forced to cancel the rest of the game all together.



https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/50801923



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZNrmEugLIM


So yeah, the ripple effect of "things Ukrainian..."

Last edited by erasure; 12-17-2019 at 11:34 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-18-2019, 07:55 AM
 
Location: Russia
1,348 posts, read 624,065 times
Reputation: 688
Trump's lawyer: "In Ukraine seized power. More than $ 100 billion stolen»

Quote:
Trump's lawyer Rudy Giuliani made a sensational statement about what actually happened in Ukraine for 5 years.

The former mayor of new York and personal lawyer of Donald trump, as promised a few hours earlier, began to publish on Twitter evidence that power in Ukraine was seized by the administration of former us President Barack Obama and their network of agents in Ukraine led by former Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko.

He claims that more than $ 100 billion was stolen from Ukraine and taken abroad.

"This is more than the fortune of Bill Gates and Mark Zuckerberg combined," Giuliani argues.

Poroshenko and members of his regime were not just allowed to steal, they stole and shared with their patrons Biden, Clinton and other democratic members.parties. The division of the stolen occurred on the principle: "70% was sent to patrons in the United States, 30% was left to Poroshenko and members of his regime."
https://vremya.com.ua/politika/4024_...nko-i-ukraine/
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-18-2019, 11:58 AM
 
26,777 posts, read 22,529,485 times
Reputation: 10037
More on gas wars;



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AFEOCed94GU


Oh, I see.. Once it's becoming obvious that US government won't be able to destroy that Nordstream 2 project, Germans will be forced to pay for the dilapidated Ukrainian transit gas system as well. (I was wondering what's up with Putin's latest promises "to keep Ukraine in business" as far as gas transit goes.)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-18-2019, 12:49 PM
 
26,777 posts, read 22,529,485 times
Reputation: 10037
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zimogor View Post
Trump's lawyer: "In Ukraine seized power. More than $ 100 billion stolen»



https://vremya.com.ua/politika/4024_...nko-i-ukraine/

Yeah, I've already heard too, that Giuliani has a *bag of goodies* to bring home after his investigation in Ukraine.


There is no more stoping for A. Derkach - he keeps on dumping all the info out in the open - of all these gas schemes, Burismas, offshore accounts, Bidens ( and not only I assume) and the rest.

A lot of new stuff to learn here.

With other words - the whole American media narration about the "the nascent democracy" that "Putin destroyed" goes down the drain.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7nD5pI3yOCQ
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-18-2019, 05:10 PM
 
9,511 posts, read 5,435,134 times
Reputation: 9092
Arsen Avakov is the key man behind the scenes in Ukraine. He runs the militias, he's the guy with the gun in the back of Zelensky and the opposition. He doesn't work for any entity of the Ukrainian government. He works for foreign interests.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nj46oqMYX9o

As a whole the Ukrainian army is pretty bad off. Airforce and Navy? Not even worth looking at.

Last edited by Scrat335; 12-18-2019 at 05:39 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-18-2019, 05:34 PM
 
9,511 posts, read 5,435,134 times
Reputation: 9092
Quote:
Oh, I see.. Once it's becoming obvious that US government won't be able to destroy that Nordstream 2 project, Germans will be forced to pay for the dilapidated Ukrainian transit gas system as well. (I was wondering what's up with Putin's latest promises "to keep Ukraine in business" as far as gas transit goes.)
I doubt Germany is going to pick up the tab, they'll make the components ect but they'll fix it so Ukraine will pay for it. Money is tight in the EU and Germany hasn't been doing that well lately. Poland is probably involved, they get a lot of welfare from the EU, many billions each year to prop them up.

The main reason the EU is so concerned about it is because they don't trust the Ukrainians to behave and Russia not have to cut off the gas to Ukraine again. The gas system in Ukraine has an issue. It only pumps gas one way, to Europe from Russia. The components in it are not designed to do it in reverse. There was no "reverse flow" from Europe to Ukraine, the Ukies were caught siphoning off gas for whatever reason and when caught a deal was reached to simply allow them to continue, and paying a higher price for what they took.

Russia is not going to sign a deal detrimental to it, if Ukraine is willing to cooperate then it will all work out. It doesn't look that way.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-18-2019, 05:36 PM
 
9,511 posts, read 5,435,134 times
Reputation: 9092
Most of that 100 billion was laundered through Latvia.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > World Forums > Europe
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top