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Old 03-31-2014, 02:05 PM
 
26,777 posts, read 22,529,485 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by movingwiththewind View Post
It's because if you exclude those 2,000 nationalists from the Right Sector from the discussion, pro-Russian posters will have absolutely no arguments left to jusfity Russia's actions.
Well exclude them and you don't have the military part of Maidan's uprising. And without this military part - no change of the government. It's that easy.
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Old 03-31-2014, 02:07 PM
 
1,863 posts, read 5,148,676 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
Well exclude them and you don't have the military part of Maidan's uprising. And without this military part - no change of the government. It's that easy.
There was a reason for the uprising.

And the reason was not destroying the Russian speaking part of the population.
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Old 03-31-2014, 02:10 PM
 
Location: Ukraine (Kiev)
435 posts, read 420,301 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariete View Post
And I would rather see the heavy industry money go to Ukraine than China, for example.
Investments from the West in our industry will be only if they have our companies in property.
Just like that anybody won't invest.
Also can do it not the worst option for Ukraine. The example of "Krivorozhstal" was not the worst, though there are many questions to this "transaction"..
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Old 03-31-2014, 02:11 PM
 
26,777 posts, read 22,529,485 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by movingwiththewind View Post
There was a reason for the uprising.

And the reason was not destroying the Russian speaking part of the population.
There was a reason for uprising - yes, but you can't skip the fact that it was the Right sector that pulled it off on its backs - the military part of it ( and without it the uprising wouldn't have achieved the success.)
The subjugation of Russian-speaking East was not a reason for this uprising - the subjugation came as the logical conclusion of it.
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Old 03-31-2014, 02:13 PM
 
Location: Ukraine (Kiev)
435 posts, read 420,301 times
Reputation: 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by movingwiththewind View Post
It's because if you exclude those 2,000 nationalists from the Right Sector from the discussion, pro-Russian posters will have absolutely no arguments left to jusfity Russia's actions.
By the way and in Lithuania, Estonia and Moldova there is the "Right sector"? Russia continues "worries" about Russians in these countries. What can be then the cause there if there is no "The right sector"?
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Old 03-31-2014, 02:15 PM
 
1,863 posts, read 5,148,676 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
There was a reason for uprising - yes, but you can't skip the fact that it was the Right sector that pulled it off on its backs.
The subjugation of Russian-speaking East was not a reason for this uprising - the subjugation came as the logical conclusion.
It's logical conclusion FOR YOU. Not everybody shares YOUR logic, which is really no more than a (biased) opinion.
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Old 03-31-2014, 02:24 PM
 
Location: Ukraine (Kiev)
435 posts, read 420,301 times
Reputation: 82
There are interesting data on "The right sector" now: they opened fire in the center of Kiev, wounded one evromaydanovets. We don't know the exact reasons.
Now their staff was surrounded by police, and members of sector collect things and take away in trucks...

Avakov's war (the Minister of Internal Affairs of Ukraine) and "The right sector" began... Probably that from both parties this already personal opposition....

I don't think that to "The right sector" in general will allow to be in Ukraine legally...
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Old 03-31-2014, 02:29 PM
 
26,777 posts, read 22,529,485 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by movingwiththewind View Post
It's logical conclusion FOR YOU.
Obviously because I know enough about Ukraine and the current situation there.

Quote:
Not everybody shares YOUR logic, which is really no more than a (biased) opinion.
I understand, some people would rather follow their emotions (or rather wishful thinking) instead of looking at situation in realistic way.
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Old 03-31-2014, 02:49 PM
 
Location: Kennedy Heights, Ohio. USA
3,866 posts, read 3,141,827 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariete View Post
Well, this is not true. The Western European steel production has been fading, and Ukraine produces the third most steel in Europe after Russia and Germany. For example the traditional steel-producing country the UK produces barely a third of what Ukraine does. The Ukrainian equipment may be old, but the labor costs are still massively lower than in Western Europe, so they might well be highly competitive.

Many heavy industry sectors in the EU are in trouble, as manufacturing moves to poorer countries with lower labor and maintenance costs. The future of the EU industry is in specialized hi-tech goods, products, services and intellectual capacity. And I would rather see the heavy industry money go to Ukraine than China, for example.
Their steel production would faded similar to Western European steel production due to the same factors.
  1. Direct competition with China in the EU market because the EU and China are members of the World Trade Organization.
  2. Loss of their Russian export market as for Russia to exercise leverage in Ukraine's economic affairs.
I don't know if Ukraine heavy industry can compete with China's heavy industry while simultaneously losing their Russian export market.
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Old 03-31-2014, 03:00 PM
 
1,863 posts, read 5,148,676 times
Reputation: 1282
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
I understand, some people would rather follow their emotions (or rather wishful thinking) instead of looking at situation in realistic way.
No dude. Let's face it: Your "logic" follows your very biased and one-sided opinion. It's all over your posts.

But you'd still rather believe that YOUR opinion = "looking at (the) situation in (a) realistic way".

Great way to go!
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