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Old 05-16-2016, 08:06 AM
 
Location: Arizona
7,511 posts, read 4,355,916 times
Reputation: 6165

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry10 View Post
I really enjoy your posts. But I do disagree with you an another point -- due process rights for illegal aliens. Constitution (14th Amendment) does not protect illegal aliens, and does not provide them with due process rights. Yes, they are technically "invaders." We do not provide due process to invaders.

As usual, liberals have turned 14th Amendment into a pretzel to say that illegal aliens are afforded due process rights.

Govt has to carry out due process for people under the jurisdiction of the United States. Citizens and legal residents, for which the US Govt has accepted as under its protection, enjoy due process.

As an illegal alien, you don't get to decide that you are under the protection of US Constitution.
However under our current law everyone including the illegal invaders are presumed innocent until proven guilty. They would have to have their day in court. The costs would be astronomical not to mention tying up our criminal justice system for decades.

As a practical matter rounding up and deporting anyone who is suspected of being in this country illegally just wouldn't work. Unless we declared martial law and used the military to go on house to house, street to street searches in order to accomplish it. There is simply not enough law enforcement and ICE personnel to accomplish such a monumental task.

Realistically it's just not feasible. I don't want them here any more than you, but we have to come up with ways to rid this nation of them without losing our basic civil rights. Which is entirely possible.

The situation we have in this country regarding this issue should never have been allowed in the first place. But it did, and now we have to deal with the consequences of it.
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Old 05-16-2016, 08:16 AM
 
Location: Arizona
7,511 posts, read 4,355,916 times
Reputation: 6165
Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler View Post
It doesn't look like either party is going to be thrilled with so I don't see where I'd be losing out. I would rather throw votes to a third party and hope that, though it almost certainly won't win, at least gets enough to signal itself as a major player for future elections.

Anyhow, wandering so off topic now. Uh, I hope thay Preet and Eric's pursual of corrupt NYS politicians creates lasting, effective change. In that respect, things may be looking up for the state?
I hope so for your sake. I don't have to deal with it anymore. However I'd like nothing more than to see that evil, vindictive, petty little tyrant that you have as a governor being led off to prison. Geez, and I though that "Client #9" was bad. Put a set of horns on his forehead and he bears a striking resemblance to the devil. Maybe not you personally but the majority New Yorker's sure know how to pick 'em.
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Old 05-16-2016, 09:08 AM
 
444 posts, read 322,089 times
Reputation: 512
Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler View Post
Due process is, uh, a process. The problem is due process is in order while the court is figuring out what your status is (such as whether or not you're staying here illegally). It's important to understand the nuts and bolts of how something would work.

The problem with this is that 90% of the people who have a deportation court date which is usually one year or more into the future don't show up and can't be tracked by INS.

I was supporting Cruz in this election since he at least was on record for stopping all federal funds to sanctuary cities and counties. I am not sure if Trump has taken any position on this. There is so much work to be done to undo some of the work Obama has completed over the past 8 years, like loading up DC appellate courts with leftist judges, that changes will need to be done small steps at a time. Using the court system isn't a good answer.
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Old 05-16-2016, 10:05 AM
 
Location: Upstate NY/NJ
3,058 posts, read 3,825,988 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ex New Yorker View Post
By jove you've got it ol' Bean! We can't just walk up to someone arrest them and accuse them of being in this country illegally just because they're of a different nationality, the color of their skin or they way they look. There are many people that are in this country legally that fit that profile. Our basic civil rights are far too valuable to go down that road.

Although FDR did it during World War Two when they rounded up the Japanese and sent them to internment camps. I can kind of sympathize with that decision, after all they did bomb Pearl Harbor. But as a "Constitutionalist" I'm vehemently against it. Funny they didn't do that to the Germans or Italians whom we were also fighting against. A blatant disregard of the Constitution if there ever was one, and a sad chapter in our history.

However, we can turn off the spigot that attracts these illegal invaders. Providing them with absolutely nothing and arrest all those who aid, abet, harbor and provide comfort to them including politicians. Which is already illegal and would pass Constitutional muster. We can also vigorously enforce our immigration laws, instead of turning a blind eye to it. If we did all of the above the tens of millions of illegal invaders would more than likely return to their countries of origin. As conditions here would be far worse for them than where they came from. Let's face it they are here to take, take, take. They have no allegiance to this country, they display their foreign flags, bring down wages, steal jobs and social benefits that are reserved for American citizens. Very few countries even allow for this, and we are fools for letting it go on for so long. A nation without borders is no nation at all.

We are losing our sovereignty and the longer we allow for this we will be no better off than the third world countries that these illegal invaders came from.
Actually, they did: German and Italian detainees | Densho Encyclopedia

and also there was a camp for Italian and German POWs not too far from you: ABQjournal: ABQ Housed German POWs as the Second World War Raged
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Old 05-16-2016, 08:39 PM
 
Location: Ubique
4,320 posts, read 4,207,988 times
Reputation: 2822
Politicians packed the country with illegal aliens and now say "Oops, we can't deport them now. It's too many of them. Court can't handle the workload. So, Americans pay for them now"

Like I said, illegal aliens are not supposed to have due process. US Constitution does not apply to them.
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Old 05-17-2016, 08:42 AM
 
Location: In the heights
37,157 posts, read 39,430,503 times
Reputation: 21252
Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry10 View Post
Politicians packed the country with illegal aliens and now say "Oops, we can't deport them now. It's too many of them. Court can't handle the workload. So, Americans pay for them now"

Like I said, illegal aliens are not supposed to have due process. US Constitution does not apply to them.
I think you might not be thinking through the actual process part of due process.
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Old 05-17-2016, 04:00 PM
 
Location: Ubique
4,320 posts, read 4,207,988 times
Reputation: 2822
Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler View Post
I think you might not be thinking through the actual process part of due process.
I am fairly familiar with the process and have thought it thru. Not sure what part you are alluding to.
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Old 05-17-2016, 08:28 PM
 
Location: Arizona
7,511 posts, read 4,355,916 times
Reputation: 6165
Quote:
Originally Posted by VintageSunlight View Post
Actually, they did: German and Italian detainees | Densho Encyclopedia

and also there was a camp for Italian and German POWs not too far from you: ABQjournal: ABQ Housed German POWs as the Second World War Raged
Very interesting, I wasn't aware of that. I did know that POW's were held here.
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Old 05-17-2016, 08:35 PM
 
Location: Arizona
7,511 posts, read 4,355,916 times
Reputation: 6165
Quote:
Originally Posted by jgustav View Post
The problem with this is that 90% of the people who have a deportation court date which is usually one year or more into the future don't show up and can't be tracked by INS.

I was supporting Cruz in this election since he at least was on record for stopping all federal funds to sanctuary cities and counties. I am not sure if Trump has taken any position on this. There is so much work to be done to undo some of the work Obama has completed over the past 8 years, like loading up DC appellate courts with leftist judges, that changes will need to be done small steps at a time. Using the court system isn't a good answer.
YES! Another Cruz supporter.
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Old 05-17-2016, 09:33 PM
 
Location: On the Great South Bay
9,173 posts, read 13,256,248 times
Reputation: 10145
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckhthankgod View Post
Not surprising, as it is saying the same things that have been said on here for years between people retiring, moving to adjacent states(with some still working in NYS), negative population estimates(key word), to those moving South to real/perceived affordable areas, jobs, property taxes and immigrants(which have always been a part of the NYS population narrative).
Not sure how bad the situation is Upstate but on Long Island I think the cost of living has reached a turning point.

Yes, you are right that for years retirees have left New York for less expensive pastures. But its not just retirees that are talking about leaving now. Its middle age and younger adults also. And I work with a number of college interns at my job and every single one of them is talking about leaving New York, its the only way they could ever afford to both buy a house and pay the ever increasing local taxes. My neighbors are selling their house to move to Raleigh, North Carolina. And almost my entire family, my parents, my brother and sister, my cousins, my nieces and nephews, are all talking about leaving.

Look at my screen name. We go back generations here. I love Long Island, New York City and New York State but increasingly I think the handwriting is on the wall.
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