Covid virus in phoenix (ethanol, passport, comparable)

[MN-Born-n-Raised]

Originally Posted by fluffythewondercat

I pay $4 per month. Do you get a better paper for $26 more?

I also pay $4/month for the digital version. BUT, that's a one-year promo with an auto-price hike. I plan on keeping it even after the price hike.

[fluffythewondercat]

Originally Posted by MN-Born-n-Raised

I also pay $4/month for the digital version. BUT, that's a one-year promo with an auto-price hike. I plan on keeping it even after the price hike.

I don't think I will keep it. I sample lots of publications. I won't pay full freight for Bloomberg, either, when the trial is up. I find the tone of their reporting particularly repellent.

[Ponderosa]

Originally Posted by MN-Born-n-Raised

I also pay $4/month for the digital version. BUT, that's a one-year promo with an auto-price hike. I plan on keeping it even after the price hike.

Cancel it at the end of the term and they will immediately offer to renew it at $4. That was my experience, though it could change. I also have WaPo which I like better for $29 per year. Same thing happended when that subscription ran out. They offer to renew at the promo price. It's kinda ridiculous that AZ Central (AZ Republic) tries to get more than twice that for their fish wrapper.

[ajonesaz]

Originally Posted by Burning Madolf

There's also this nugget that Mexico has been 'off' about their death toll:


https://apnews.com/article/coronavir...&utm_medium=AP

US is the only country in the world that does "death certificate matching". I really think the CDC should split the numbers of those who pass in a clinical setting vs death certificate matching. It really skews our numbers.

[Valley Native]

Originally Posted by Oklazona Bound

In science sometimes things are fluid like in a pandemic. What appeared to be the right decision early on can and should be changed as new information comes in. Its silly to bash Fauci. He has been right most of the time. And he was early on saying this pandemic was a big problem even when others early on said it was going to just disappear by Easter.

Here's what we have to realize: while science & medicine aren't cut & dry, Fauci should not have made such statements, especially since we didn't know enough about COVID early on. Saying things like "there is absolutely no reason whatsoever to wear a mask", or telling Americans that there is nothing to worry about goes beyond being mistaken or mildly foolish ... especially somebody in his position. Of course, he wasn't the only one in the public spotlight who made similar blatantly incorrect remarks, but maybe, just maybe people would have taken the virus more seriously early on if these "experts" took it more seriously when the outbreak was happening in China.

[MN-Born-n-Raised]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

Here's what we have to realize: while science & medicine aren't cut & dry, Fauci should not have made such statements, especially since we didn't know enough about COVID early on. Saying things like "there is absolutely no reason whatsoever to wear a mask", or telling Americans that there is nothing to worry about goes beyond being mistaken or mildly foolish ... especially somebody in his position. Of course, he wasn't the only one in the public spotlight who made similar blatantly incorrect remarks, but maybe, just maybe people would have taken the virus more seriously early on if these "experts" took it more seriously when the outbreak was happening in China.

His exact words on March 6th were:
“There’s no reason to be walking around with a mask. When you’re in the middle of an outbreak, wearing a mask might make people feel a little bit better and it might even block a droplet, but it’s not providing the perfect protection that people think that it is. And, often, there are unintended consequences — people keep fiddling with the mask and they keep touching their face.”

We knew plenty about masks with a COVID strain. In fact, I was so outraged that I posted many times (in which I predict the mod flushed in a mass delete) specific studies that were done more than a decade ago showing the benefits of a quality mask.

So what he really meant to say was:
We will have near-zero PPE if there is a run on them. If everyone wants a quality N95, we will run out of supply in a few days. 300M+ Americans at one mask a day == about a BILLION masks usage in just a few days. Even now, 3M ramped up to about 2 Billion a year or about a week's worth of N95 mask supply JUST in the USA. That all said, I had my N95 stash early on and reused them to regain the static element of protection per the designer of the N95 mask. I never used a POS mask. If some guy in AZ researched papers on mask studies, obviously Fauci knew it better than anyone.

So yes, he bold-faced lied and I posted that our lovely Surgeon General was lying as well. In the end, people have been wearing semi-worthless cloth masks (some better than others).


Re: China. Frontline (PBS which can easily be streamed) did an informative expose on how China has been stalling, lying, and manipulating everything to do with COVID. It's very well documented. What a POS country. They were playing with fire. Watch it and you will get angry.

[Valley Native]

Originally Posted by MN-Born-n-Raised

Re: China. Frontline (PBS which can easily be streamed) did an informative expose on how China has been stalling, lying, and manipulating everything to do with COVID. It's very well documented. What a POS country. They were playing with fire. Watch it and you will get angry.

As I said previously: don't get me started on China. It's pretty well known by now how the Chinese government made every attempt to cover up the COVID outbreak from the very beginning, which isn't surprising given their track record. In a nutshell, they've allowed themselves to be a piece of s**t country!

[Ponderosa]

Originally Posted by MN-Born-n-Raised

His exact words on March 6th were:
“There’s no reason to be walking around with a mask. When you’re in the middle of an outbreak, wearing a mask might make people feel a little bit better and it might even block a droplet, but it’s not providing the perfect protection that people think that it is. And, often, there are unintended consequences — people keep fiddling with the mask and they keep touching their face.”

We knew plenty about masks with a COVID strain. In fact, I was so outraged that I posted many times (in which I predict the mod flushed in a mass delete) specific studies that were done more than a decade ago showing the benefits of a quality mask.

So what he really meant to say was:
We will have near-zero PPE if there is a run on them. If everyone wants a quality N95, we will run out of supply in a few days. 300M+ Americans at one mask a day == about a BILLION masks usage in just a few days. Even now, 3M ramped up to about 2 Billion a year or about a week's worth of N95 mask supply JUST in the USA. That all said, I had my N95 stash early on and reused them to regain the static element of protection per the designer of the N95 mask. I never used a POS mask. If some guy in AZ researched papers on mask studies, obviously Fauci knew it better than anyone.

So yes, he bold-faced lied and I posted that our lovely Surgeon General was lying as well. In the end, people have been wearing semi-worthless cloth masks (some better than others).


Re: China. Frontline (PBS which can easily be streamed) did an informative expose on how China has been stalling, lying, and manipulating everything to do with COVID. It's very well documented. What a POS country. They were playing with fire. Watch it and you will get angry.

He was right. Whether he was right to lie about the masks to try to preserve them for health care workers can be debated (but not fairly for long). Telling the truth is not always the best public policy, like it or not.

[MN-Born-n-Raised]

Originally Posted by Ponderosa

He was right. Whether he was right to lie about the masks to try to preserve them for health care workers can be debated (but not fairly for long). Telling the truth is not always the best public policy, like it or not.

When you don't tell the truth or lie when it related to life and death specifically to public health policy, it makes people forever suspicious. So what you are saying is that it would be right for the government to lie to people and say "the vaccines are safe" when they might not be for everyone.

Speaking for myself, I didn't take anybody's word about vaccine safety because I learned that I couldn't. I spoke with a research customer of mine who studies genetic sequencing at Novavax. And I read everything that I could before I personally signed off on getting a shot. But I surely did not trust Fauci by default (who is a pretty good politician) simply because he told me so. It's taken me some time to trust him because of that lie.

A key problem re: to PPE was that multiple administrations didn't listen to the USA-manufactured PPE suppliers. They warned what will happen if a virus comes to town. And there were many other dropped PPE balls. Read https://www.washingtonpost.com/inves...691_story.html

"We still have four like-new N95 manufacturing lines,” Bowen wrote that day in an email to top administrators in the Department of Health and Human Services. “Reactivating these machines would be very difficult and very expensive but could be achieved in a dire situation.”

But communications over several days with senior agency officials — including Robert Kad*lec, the assistant secretary for preparedness and emergency response — left Bowen with the clear impression that there was little immediate interest in his offer."

This is one of many dropped balls.

[Ponderosa]

Originally Posted by MN-Born-n-Raised

When you don't tell the truth or lie when it related to life and death public health policy, it makes people forever suspicious. So what you are saying is that it would be o.k. for the government to lie to people and say "the vaccines are safe" when they might not be for everyone? What went on in my head is I cannot trust the government's words.

Speaking for myself, I didn't take anybody's word about vaccine safety. I spoke with a customer who studies genetic sequencing at Novavax plus reading everything I could before I personally signed off on it. I concluded that it was safe. But surely not because Fauci (who is a pretty good politician) told me so.

A key problem was that multiple administrations didn't listen to the USA-manufactured PPE suppliers. They warned what will happen if a virus comes to town. Hell, https://www.washingtonpost.com/inves...691_story.html

"We still have four like-new N95 manufacturing lines,” Bowen wrote that day in an email to top administrators in the Department of Health and Human Services. “Reactivating these machines would be very difficult and very expensive but could be achieved in a dire situation.”

But communications over several days with senior agency officials — including Robert Kad*lec, the assistant secretary for preparedness and emergency response — left Bowen with the clear impression that there was little immediate interest in his offer." There were many other dropped balls re: to PPE.

No. That is not what I am saying. It is more complicated than that. Things are not black and white; all choices are not binary. I know you understand that so I will leave it there.