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Old 12-08-2011, 02:49 PM
 
Location: US
26,264 posts, read 13,930,302 times
Reputation: 1593

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Quote:
Originally Posted by modeerf View Post
No, that is the excuse of religion hypocrisy and mans justifications. Matthew clearly says to be Perfect as God is Perfect.. Mature? just doesn't have the same power as Perfect. It is why the word Perfect is used. Everyone knows God is Mature, and others reach maturity in the flesh without much effort or care.

Enoch was also a Perfect man, and he did not see death... the proof of overcoming sin.

Rev 3:21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

Jesus overcame the world, which is a fallen sin filled place. Through His guidance and power, we too, can overcome. You must first believe it is possible, before that fruit will produce its goodness.



That is what i said. He doesn't condone sin.
G5046
τέλειος
teleios
tel'-i-os
From G5056; complete (in various applications of labor, growth, mental and moral character, etc.); neuter (as noun, with G3588) completeness: - of full age, man, perfect.

G3583
 
ξηραίνω
xērainō
xay-rah'ee-no
From G3584; to desiccate; by implication to shrivel, to mature: - dry up, pine away, be ripe, wither (away).

G5048
 
τελειόω
teleioō
tel-i-o'-o
From G5046; to complete, that is, (literally) accomplish, or (figuratively) consummate (in character): - consecrate, finish, fulfil, (make) perfect.

G187
 
ακμάζω
akmazō
ak-mad'-zo
From the same as G188; to make a point, that is, (figuratively) mature: - be fully ripe.

G5056
τέλος
telos
tel'-os
From a primary word τέλλω tellō (to set out for a definite point or goal); properly the point aimed at as a limit, that is, (by implication) the conclusion of an act or state (termination [literally, figuratively or indefinitely], result [immediate, ultimate or prophetic], purpose); specifically an impost or levy (as paid): - + continual, custom, end (-ing), finally, uttermost. Compare G5411.

Kinda gives me the implication maturity...
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Old 12-08-2011, 05:00 PM
 
3,337 posts, read 2,483,566 times
Reputation: 921
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
G5046
τέλειος
teleios
tel'-i-os
From G5056; complete (in various applications of labor, growth, mental and moral character, etc.); neuter (as noun, with G3588) completeness: - of full age, man, perfect.

G3583
 
ξηραίνω
xērainō
xay-rah'ee-no
From G3584; to desiccate; by implication to shrivel, to mature: - dry up, pine away, be ripe, wither (away).

G5048
 
τελειόω
teleioō
tel-i-o'-o
From G5046; to complete, that is, (literally) accomplish, or (figuratively) consummate (in character): - consecrate, finish, fulfil, (make) perfect.

G187
 
ακμάζω
akmazō
ak-mad'-zo
From the same as G188; to make a point, that is, (figuratively) mature: - be fully ripe.

G5056
τέλος
telos
tel'-os
From a primary word τέλλω tellō (to set out for a definite point or goal); properly the point aimed at as a limit, that is, (by implication) the conclusion of an act or state (termination [literally, figuratively or indefinitely], result [immediate, ultimate or prophetic], purpose); specifically an impost or levy (as paid): - + continual, custom, end (-ing), finally, uttermost. Compare G5411.

Kinda gives me the implication maturity...
So Jesus nor any of the Prophets or Apostle's overcame Sin? Wouldn't that be a Mature thing for them to be?
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Old 12-08-2011, 08:15 PM
 
17,732 posts, read 8,879,421 times
Reputation: 1487
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade View Post

The Apostle Paul used the verb hamartano when he wrote, "For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God "
(Romans 3:23)
It means to error as a result of ignorance, regardless of whether it is mental, verbal or overt to some degree.
Chatta'ah is from the Hebrew verb chata' meaning; to miss the mark, not unlike that of hamartano in the Greek.

"For all have fallen short in this life, that's why we continue to learn from our mistakes."

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Old 12-09-2011, 12:39 AM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 8,389,248 times
Reputation: 1690
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade View Post
It means to error as a result of ignorance, regardless of whether it is mental, verbal or overt to some degree.
Chatta'ah is from the Hebrew verb chata' meaning; to miss the mark, not unlike that of hamartano in the Greek.

"For all have fallen short in this life, that's why we continue to learn from our mistakes."

Exactly!
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Old 12-09-2011, 03:03 AM
 
Location: US
26,264 posts, read 13,930,302 times
Reputation: 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by modeerf View Post
So Jesus nor any of the Prophets or Apostle's overcame Sin? Wouldn't that be a Mature thing for them to be?
I see it corresponding with what is said in the Epistles regarding coming to the full knowledge of the Truth...I wonder if man, under the Old and New Covenants, were able to please Hawyaw, why was it necessary for Jeshua to come and be sacrificed?...As Jeshua said, He did not come to call the righteous, but the unrighteous to repentance and Salvation...He was sent only for the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel...Was the many things Jeshua commanded in the Gospel accounts to prove to man that he was unable to do anything under his own power to please Hawyaw?...Paul said there are none righteous...Hawyaw said no one seeks after Him nor are they able to...But Jeshua says to seek the Kingdom of Hawyaw...Jeshua commands one to be perfect as the Father is Perfect...How can this be!?...Is Jeshua commanding them to do something that he knows full well they are incapable of doing?...Just as He commanded the Rich Young Ruler?...That if he wanted to be perfect, to sell all he had and follow Him?...Knowing full well what the Rich Young Ruler was going to do?...There is obviously something else going on here, something deeper than just what is on the surface of the printed page...When I was in Electronic Engineering school there were many that would just memorize the information and regurgitate it on a test without intimately understanding the prosesses...They would harass me for questioning the Professor regarding what was going on deeper in these prosesses...I wanted to know them intimately not just on the surface...even down to the sub-atomic level...My persistence brought me a deeper understanding and appreciation for the structures of electronics...I understood not just that current flows through a conductor, but how and why to the point where I could visualize the activity in my minds eye...That energy cannot be created or destroyed, but can be altered into different forms...Ones body is composed of energy, wood is composed of energy, etc...This is the difference between one that parrots what he reads from a book and one who intimately understands what he has read...We know that a ferrous material spinning in a magnetic field creates electricity...But how and why?...Don't just know the answer, understand the answer...
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Old 12-09-2011, 10:11 AM
 
3,337 posts, read 2,483,566 times
Reputation: 921
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
I see it corresponding with what is said in the Epistles regarding coming to the full knowledge of the Truth...I wonder if man, under the Old and New Covenants, were able to please Hawyaw, why was it necessary for Jeshua to come and be sacrificed?...As Jeshua said, He did not come to call the righteous, but the unrighteous to repentance and Salvation...He was sent only for the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel...Was the many things Jeshua commanded in the Gospel accounts to prove to man that he was unable to do anything under his own power to please Hawyaw?...Paul said there are none righteous...Hawyaw said no one seeks after Him nor are they able to...But Jeshua says to seek the Kingdom of Hawyaw...Jeshua commands one to be perfect as the Father is Perfect...How can this be!?...Is Jeshua commanding them to do something that he knows full well they are incapable of doing?...Just as He commanded the Rich Young Ruler?...That if he wanted to be perfect, to sell all he had and follow Him?...Knowing full well what the Rich Young Ruler was going to do?...There is obviously something else going on here, something deeper than just what is on the surface of the printed page...When I was in Electronic Engineering school there were many that would just memorize the information and regurgitate it on a test without intimately understanding the prosesses...They would harass me for questioning the Professor regarding what was going on deeper in these prosesses...I wanted to know them intimately not just on the surface...even down to the sub-atomic level...My persistence brought me a deeper understanding and appreciation for the structures of electronics...I understood not just that current flows through a conductor, but how and why to the point where I could visualize the activity in my minds eye...That energy cannot be created or destroyed, but can be altered into different forms...Ones body is composed of energy, wood is composed of energy, etc...This is the difference between one that parrots what he reads from a book and one who intimately understands what he has read...We know that a ferrous material spinning in a magnetic field creates electricity...But how and why?...Don't just know the answer, understand the answer...
My understanding believes that Jesus would give no command save he prepared the way for it's full-fill-ment, and His love would never mock us by commanding/presenting/teaching... something we are incapable of receiving.

If you applied the same tenacity at overcoming sin, as you did to understand electronics. You would shortly arrive at Maturity / Perfection.

Jesus is not JUST the way... HE shows us the way. And a stranger we will not follow, if we be and live according to his promises.

If one's eyes are single to His glory, you would be filled with light and become what you interpret.

The sad part to me is that the masses have accepted mediocrity through Christ, and have avoided the path to Oneness to the point it is not desired or fulfilled.

His Kingdom is not in Word, but POWER. His desire is to share His power which brings about purity through and by living his word.
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Old 12-09-2011, 10:37 AM
 
Location: Florida
5,261 posts, read 6,236,240 times
Reputation: 837
Quote:
Originally Posted by modeerf View Post
My understanding believes that Jesus would give no command save he prepared the way for it's full-fill-ment, and His love would never mock us by commanding/presenting/teaching... something we are incapable of receiving.

If you applied the same tenacity at overcoming sin, as you did to understand electronics. You would shortly arrive at Maturity / Perfection.

Jesus is not JUST the way... HE shows us the way. And a stranger we will not follow, if we be and live according to his promises.

If one's eyes are single to His glory, you would be filled with light and become what you interpret.

The sad part to me is that the masses have accepted mediocrity through Christ, and have avoided the path to Oneness to the point it is not desired or fulfilled.

His Kingdom is not in Word, but POWER. His desire is to share His power which brings about purity through and by living his word.
Wow...excellant post. Amen!
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Old 12-10-2011, 04:11 AM
 
Location: US
26,264 posts, read 13,930,302 times
Reputation: 1593
Quote:
Originally Posted by modeerf View Post
My understanding believes that Jesus would give no command save he prepared the way for it's full-fill-ment, and His love would never mock us by commanding/presenting/teaching... something we are incapable of receiving.

If you applied the same tenacity at overcoming sin, as you did to understand electronics. You would shortly arrive at Maturity / Perfection.

Jesus is not JUST the way... HE shows us the way. And a stranger we will not follow, if we be and live according to his promises.

If one's eyes are single to His glory, you would be filled with light and become what you interpret.

The sad part to me is that the masses have accepted mediocrity through Christ, and have avoided the path to Oneness to the point it is not desired or fulfilled.

His Kingdom is not in Word, but POWER. His desire is to share His power which brings about purity through and by living his word.
Ahh, Oneness Pentacostalism...
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Old 12-10-2011, 01:18 PM
 
3,337 posts, read 2,483,566 times
Reputation: 921
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
Ahh, Oneness Pentacostalism...
Epiphany to you through association, or deflection from the teaching of Oneness.

Help me out here. Are you saying it is a sound doctrine to you, or depending on what the Pentacostals teach (which i have no idea), are you saying that it must be wrong?
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Old 12-10-2011, 01:57 PM
 
1,837 posts, read 1,585,923 times
Reputation: 297
Nice thread! And happy Holy Sabbath Day!!!
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