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Old 04-29-2016, 02:50 AM
 
Location: Nashville, TN
5,070 posts, read 4,104,883 times
Reputation: 3694

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckeye614 View Post
The Rust Belt is a term for the region straddling the upper Northeastern United States, the Great Lakes, and the Midwest States, referring to economic decline, population loss, and urban decay due to the shrinking of its once powerful industrial sector. Based on this definition how would you categorize the various Midwestern cities?

This list is meant to spur conversation, not to offend, and is by no means definitive in nature. If you disagree simply state why respectfully and present new information

Not rust belt:
Minneapolis-St. Paul
Columbus
Indianapolis
Kansas City
Omaha
Madison
Des Moines
Ann Arbor

Debatable
Cleveland (making a comeback but not sure if there is a ton of population growth in city limits)
Cincinnati (Not sure where to categorize Cincy)
Pittsburgh (also having a renaissance, not sure to what extent though)
Chicago (losing population, still the most powerful economic force in the Midwest by far)
Milwaukee (not familiar with it, so that's the main reason for this category)

Solidly Rustbelt
Detroit (proper)
St. Louis
Akron
Dayton
Gary
Flint
Toledo
Youngstown
Pittsburgh, Cleveland, and Milwaukee don't seem debatable to me. By process of elimination, some would say that Pittsburgh doesn't belong because it is not located in the Midwest. Same goes for Buffalo.

 
Old 04-29-2016, 07:37 AM
 
56,637 posts, read 80,930,134 times
Reputation: 12509
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjlo View Post
Hi my name is Grand Rapids, i'm a midwestern city of almost 200,000 people with a metro area of over 1 million people. I grew up as an industrial city during the manufacturing age and had some of the same symptoms of decline exhibited in other midwestern/rust belt cities. However since the 80/90s i've started quickly transitioning into more of a knowledge/health care/services based city. I am noted for my stronger than average population growth, billions of dollars of new investment, evolving social scene, and rocking economy. However people forget I exist alot.
Yes, it is a sleeper and if Lansing-East Lansing could step it up a notch in terms of private enployment, it could be on the same track due for similar reasons.
 
Old 04-29-2016, 09:46 AM
 
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
5,954 posts, read 7,324,357 times
Reputation: 3739
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckeye614 View Post
Pittsburgh is about 33 miles from the Ohio border while it's 304 miles from Philadelphia. Is Ohio in the Midwest?

Either way you are entitled to your beliefs and I'm not here to change them
LOL what's your point? Last time I checked that doesn't mean it's in Ohio and the part of Ohio near it is rather rural. Is Buffalo Canadian since it's right next to Ontario by using your logic?
 
Old 04-29-2016, 11:11 AM
 
Location: Cbus
1,721 posts, read 1,403,138 times
Reputation: 2089
Quote:
Originally Posted by bradjl2009 View Post
LOL what's your point? Last time I checked that doesn't mean it's in Ohio and the part of Ohio near it is rather rural. Is Buffalo Canadian since it's right next to Ontario by using your logic?
I never said it was in Ohio. A sensible person could draw the conclusion that seeing that Pittsburgh is a mere 30 miles from the Ohio border it is not illogical to surmise that there would be some cultural overlap between Eastern Ohio and Pittsburgh. That being said several posters have already adamantly asserted that Pittsburgh is in fact not mid-western and is a northeastern city culturally. I already conceded that point so can we please move on.
 
Old 04-29-2016, 11:37 AM
 
Location: Boston, MA
8,729 posts, read 7,686,254 times
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Cleveland, Milwaukee, Pittsburgh all actively embrace the term "Rust Belt." Just look at all the businesses and stuff that use the phrase.

In fact, I think these are the single largest users of "Rust Belt." Cleveland and Pittsburgh are the cities that come to mind immediately for me actually. They seem like the perfect examples. You cannot walk through Cleveland and Pittsburgh and not feel what the cities must have been like when heavy industry dominated.
 
Old 04-29-2016, 12:59 PM
 
5,805 posts, read 8,567,679 times
Reputation: 3051
Quote:
Originally Posted by bjimmy24 View Post
In fact, I think these are the single largest users of "Rust Belt." Cleveland and Pittsburgh are the cities that come to mind immediately for me actually. They seem like the perfect examples. You cannot walk through Cleveland and Pittsburgh and not feel what the cities must have been like when heavy industry dominated.
Same could be said for both Baltimore and Philadelphia ... I love how these 2 seem to escape the term "rust belt" when they too were heavily industrilalized and still show heavy signs of their rustic past in their most blight filled neighborhoods.

I guess because being in the Cosmopolitan Acela NEC would be an Oxymoron to "Rust Belt" .... :laughs, and sighs:, CvC I tell'ya this place.......SMDH
 
Old 04-29-2016, 01:08 PM
 
7,707 posts, read 4,569,470 times
Reputation: 8423
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackbeauty212 View Post
Same could be said for both Baltimore and Philadelphia ... I love how these 2 seem to escape the term "rust belt" when they too were heavily industrilalized and still show heavy signs of their rustic past in their most blight filled neighborhoods.

I guess because being in the Cosmopolitan Acela NEC would be an Oxymoron to "Rust Belt" .... :laughs, and sighs:, CvC I tell'ya this place.......SMDH
The best part is that most of these "it's the metro that counts" NEC boosters live 45min to an hour away from their superior East Coast cities.
 
Old 04-29-2016, 01:29 PM
 
Location: Pittsburgh, PA (Morningside)
12,427 posts, read 11,929,235 times
Reputation: 10539
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckeye614 View Post
I never said it was in Ohio. A sensible person could draw the conclusion that seeing that Pittsburgh is a mere 30 miles from the Ohio border it is not illogical to surmise that there would be some cultural overlap between Eastern Ohio and Pittsburgh. That being said several posters have already adamantly asserted that Pittsburgh is in fact not mid-western and is a northeastern city culturally. I already conceded that point so can we please move on.
There is cultural crossover, but IMHO Pittsburgh influence isn't really found any further west than Youngstown.

But there's no such thing as someone being "culturally Northeastern" or "Culturally Midwestern" which is why the argument is silly. Someone in Vermont shares more in common culturally with someone from northern Wisconsin than someone from central Pennsylvania. Similarly, the person from central Pennsylvania might feel more akin to someone from Indiana. Northeast and Midwest are geographic descriptors - they aren't also cultural folkways like being southern is.
 
Old 04-29-2016, 03:57 PM
 
1,112 posts, read 696,020 times
Reputation: 396
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackbeauty212 View Post
Same could be said for both Baltimore and Philadelphia ... I love how these 2 seem to escape the term "rust belt" when they too were heavily industrilalized and still show heavy signs of their rustic past in their most blight filled neighborhoods.
I can't speak for Philly, but Baltimore is doing better than metros like Cleveland. Our suburbs continually grow...

Baltimore was industrial, but I might not call it rust belt because it was not it as hard as rust belt cities were by deindustrialization.

What I mean is this:
DC lost about 30% of its population in its late-century decline. Boston and Minneapolis lost similar proportions. Even Norfolk lost about a quarter of its population and Baltimore lost one-third. Birmingham, AL lost a larger percentage (about 3/8 IIRC, it was also an industrial city).

Pittsburgh lost half of its population. Cleveland more than 50%, Detroit and St. Louis lost more than 60%. The difference is staggering to me.

Another thing is that the rust belt cities had population increases of over 100 up to even 500 percent during their earlier years (a few decades into the 1800s, usually). The biggest decade for Baltimore during the 1790s, before all the major industrialization took place nearly doubled and had 75% increase in the earliest decade of the 1800s. After that, the largest growth was over 40% in the 1840s, which still pales in comparison to cities to the northwest.

And it makes sense when you look at the list of largest cities in the US over time; what were just before insignificant northwestern towns in the rocketed above Baltimore in the 19th century.

Last edited by ialmostforgot; 04-29-2016 at 04:16 PM..
 
Old 04-29-2016, 04:09 PM
 
7,707 posts, read 4,569,470 times
Reputation: 8423
Quote:
Originally Posted by ialmostforgot View Post
I can't speak for Philly, but Baltimore is doing better than metros like Cleveland. Our suburbs continually grow...

Baltimore was industrial, but I might not call it rust belt because it was not it as hard as rust belt cities were by deindustrialization.

What I mean is this:
DC lost about 30% of its population in its late-century decline. Boston and Minneapolis lost similar proportions. Even Norfolk, VA lost about a quarter of its population and Baltimore lost one-third.

Pittsburgh lost half of its population. Cleveland more than 50%, Detroit and St. Louis lost more than 60%. The difference is staggering to me.

Another thing is that the rust belt cities had population increases of over 100 up to even 500 percent during their earlier years. The biggest decade for Baltimore was the 1840s, during which they gained over 40%.
Between 1950 and the present, Baltimore lost 35% of its population. It went from being the sixth largest city, to the 26th. It is most certainly a Rust Belt city. That's not an indictment, it's just a fact.
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