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Born and bred in DC boy here- Georgetown U Hospital 1965.
Anyway, I think you are correct. Its funny when I went to college in New York, lots of people asked me why I did not have a Southern accent. I always explained that DC was pretty much on the border- you have to draw the line somewhere. Personally, I always thought it was southern Fairfax County where the accents started and grits were on the menu. I read a book that said it was the Rhappahanock River.
Now, the funny thing is that I have met some old time folks i.e. DC natives who were here in the city before the white flight of the 60s. They invariably have something resembling a southern accent. Add to that the fact that DC was segregated at one point- the old "Reno Colored School" is next to my junior high although its been a long time since it was used for that purpose.
So I have always theorized that DC was more southern in the past but has simply morphed away from it. It was probably never as southern as a place like Charleston or Atlanta- it was the capital of the Union after all. And the fact of the matter is most people here are from elsewhere, whether elsewhere is another part of the US or another country.
Virginia is not part of D.C., though\ IMO. Virginia is Virginia. D.C. is a seperate state.
Its not as Southern as it was, though.
I always thought the Potomac River was the dividing line between the north and south culturally. The Potomac River actually starts up in Bekley Springs, West VA
There was also a book written called "Life below the Potomac".
What in the world "feels south" about DC? There aren't any southern accents, there isn't any southern food, transplants from all over the world, and it has a bustling culture with a brusque attitude -- those are hardly attributes of a Southern city. Coming from the Philly area and currently attending school in DC, I have a good basis of comparison, and I can tell you it's definitely the tail end of the Northeastern megalopolis.
Go down to South Carolina, Tennessee, Georgia, or Mississippi and you will see a real basis for comparison that makes referring to DC as the "South" pretty laughable.
By "feels south", I mean that skin color is used by blacks in DC to determine hierarchy. A warped sense of being IMO, but this is not a northern trait. Light-skinned blacks consider themselves "better" than darker-skinned blacks. Pointy, small nose, thin lips, straighter hair are all traits of the more "favorable" people in this region and this is distinctly a southern trait, is it not?
DC is South! It benefits from being closer to the north than say cities in Mississippi and from its place as the nation's capital.
By "feels south", I mean that skin color is used by blacks in DC to determine hierarchy. A warped sense of being IMO, but this is not a northern trait. Light-skinned blacks consider themselves "better" than darker-skinned blacks. Pointy, small nose, thin lips, straighter hair are all traits of the more "favorable" people in this region and this is distinctly a southern trait, is it not?
DC is South! It benefits from being closer to the north than say cities in Mississippi and from its place as the nation's capital.
This is honestly the first time I've ever heard anyone make that observation about DC Blacks. However, that's hardly a Southern trait, that's a NATIONAL trait. Many Blacks believe in order to assimilate and get ahead in this society, they have to dilute their ethnic traits. It's certainly unfortunate, but to think that's only found in the South is pretty naive. Go to any major city, and I think you'll find lots of Blacks trying to make themselves appear more "White" -- particularly more affluent ones.
You can disagree if you want. On the map, it looks to be right in the middle of the East Coast. Therefore, its not in the Northeast.
I feel this is getting pretty repetitive, so I'm going to say my spiel one last time: You're arguing about geography, and I'm arguing about culture. Today -- not 100 or perhaps even 50 years ago -- Northeastern CULTURE has a stranglehold on the DC area, and I don't think anyone that hasn't been hiding under a rock would deny that.
Besides, you said the Mid-Atlantic shouldn't be considered the Northeast, but one of your sources claims that the collective region of the Northeast consists of New England and the Mid-Atlantic.
This is honestly the first time I've ever heard anyone make that observation about DC Blacks. However, that's hardly a Southern trait, that's a NATIONAL trait. Many Blacks believe in order to assimilate and get ahead in this society, they have to dilute their ethnic traits. It's certainly unfortunate, but to think that's only found in the South is pretty naive. Go to any major city, and I think you'll find lots of Blacks trying to make themselves appear more "White" -- particularly more affluent ones.
This is not true. Being "color-struck" is not a northern trait, but rather a trait by southerners who have migrated north as well as a southern trait. Being a 3rd-generation northerner, among my parents and grandparents in the north and the black people they grew up with in the north, there was absolutely no mindset to "dilute" their ethnic traits. No, this is strictly a southern trait.
Ever hear of the black family in Virginia who married only within the family to preserve the lighter skin tone? I can't remember the last name. So intent and obsessed with lighter skin (presumably to do as you say) that they only inbred. Shameful, and certainly not a practice of northern blacks born and bred.
True northern blacks don't feel the need to dilute, having always been raised and treated by all races in the north as simply "people."
This is not true. Being "color-struck" is not a northern trait, but rather a trait by southerners who have migrated north as well as a southern trait. Being a 3rd-generation northerner, among my parents and grandparents in the north and the black people they grew up with in the north, there was absolutely no mindset to "dilute" their ethnic traits. No, this is strictly a southern trait.
I strongly disagree. I've seen plenty of Blacks in, say, the Philly area, New York, and Boston with the same kind of look as Blacks in the DC area. I think you have it backwards, because although the Northeast was considered a "haven" for Blacks during and after the Era of Slavery, MANY Northerners were disdainful of the Black/African culture. This has been manifested into racial tension that exists to this day, and the relatively few Blacks that made into the upper-echelons of society often did so by divorcing themselves from Black culture. Certainly strong pockets of Black culture exist in the Northeast today, but they are overwhelmingly found in very segregated, impoverished areas.
Quote:
Originally Posted by buckfush
True northern blacks don't feel the need to dilute, having always been raised and treated by all races in the north as simply "people."
You seem to think that minorities have always received equal treatment in the North, which is hardly true. Of course, the North was never involved in slavery, but to think that Blacks were accepted with open arms is an extremely innaccurate image. There, too, is a strong history of racism in the North that exists on a much more subtle, "behind closed doors" level. Your view that only Southern Blacks would want to make themselves appear more White falls under the logic to which many people of this country ignorantly subscribe -- that racism is exclusively fault of the South, when that couldn't be any further from the truth. Look into the history of Race Riots, for example, and you'll find the extent to which racism permeates regional stereotypes.
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