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Old 05-05-2010, 03:25 PM
 
Location: I think my user name clarifies that.
8,293 posts, read 23,165,383 times
Reputation: 3889

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Quote:
Originally Posted by DTO Luv View Post
I figured you'd say that last part. I barely have time to even read this site anymore. I have no time to go around town with you trying to prove a point I already know. Keep huffing and puffing with your big, bad self.

You're purposefully confusing visitations with the ability to make decisions on behalf of someone who is incapacitated. Spouses have that default right in those situations (like they did with Terri Schiavo). Lets assume that we did have legal status and were married in Iowa but lived in Nebraska. Even though we may have legal rights in Iowa they vanish as soon as we cross the river. You claim the situation that gays are turned away from hospitals never happens and I just provided you information stating that it does in fact happen. You can make up your own opinions, you can't make up facts. The fact is there are laws and policies in place (Nebraska among them) where gays don't have rights to make decisions over would-be spouses in medical situations like heterosexual couples do.
So you, as a BOYFRIEND, can't make major medical decisions for somebody.

Big whoop.

If you weren't gay and you had a girlfriend instead of a boyfriend, you STILL couldn't make major medical decisions for that person. Why? Because you're a BOYFRIEND. Guess what champ. If my adult daughter is in the hospital for some reason, it will NOT be her BOYFRIEND making major medical decisions for her. It will be her PARENTS.


And didn't you say he's not your BOYFRIEND anymore? That alone makes your whole argument a moot point.
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Old 05-05-2010, 03:29 PM
 
Location: I think my user name clarifies that.
8,293 posts, read 23,165,383 times
Reputation: 3889
Quote:
Originally Posted by itsMeFred View Post
precisely.
Yet a spouse would have next-of-kin rights.

That's the point that is being made.
There are certain legal rights that accompany marriage.

On the contrary, because I'm straight, my marriage is legally recognized.
Because I'm straight, I'm my husband's next of kin.
Because I'm straight I'm allowed to make medical decisions for my spouse.

THOSE RIGHTS ARE DENIED TO GAY PARTNERS.

It's discrimination. Pure and simple.
You are right, there is some discrimination.

But here's the problem: When people like DTOLuv and SurfOmaha constantly "Cry Wolf" about fictional prejudices and persecution, it both destroys their credibility and diminishes the weight of the legitimate arguments.

They have both claimed that gays aren't allowed hospital visitation rights simply because they are gay. Well guess what? They are both DEAD WRONG. That is a lie. Period. I've repeatedly proven it, and even offered DTO the opportunity to go to hospitals with me to prove that he can walk right in just like I can (he declined, of course, because he knows what will happen).

Why they cannot understand that is beyond me.


That said, you might want to look more closely into all of these "supposed" rights that spouses have. Yet again, one name: Terri Schiavo.
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Old 05-05-2010, 04:09 PM
 
Location: Western Nebraskansas
2,707 posts, read 5,357,657 times
Reputation: 2415
and if you know anything about the Terri Shiavo case, you already know that it was a rarity. The vast majority of the time, those types of decisions are made by spouses. Even if parents object.

So far as what other people might have claimed in this thread, I think you're misreading them. I just can't decide if it's deliberate or not.
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Old 05-05-2010, 04:22 PM
 
Location: I think my user name clarifies that.
8,293 posts, read 23,165,383 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by itsMeFred View Post
and if you know anything about the Terri Shiavo case, you already know that it was a rarity. The vast majority of the time, those types of decisions are made by spouses. Even if parents object.

So far as what other people might have claimed in this thread, I think you're misreading them. I just can't decide if it's deliberate or not.
I'm not misreading anything, nor am I misrepresenting anything. I'm just really sick of all the hyperbole, BS, lying and PLOM persecution complex that is constantly being paraded by some gays.

They claim they can't visit people in the hospital. That is a lie.
They claim they can't rent apartments our houses. That is a lie.
They claim they can't buy a house together. That is a lie.
They claim they can't go to church together. That is a lie.
They claim they can't transfer their estate to their partner. That is a lie.
They claim they can't get the tax benefits of married couples. That is a lie.
Shall I go on?

How much lying do I have to sit and listen to before I stand up and say, "You're lying!"?
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Old 05-05-2010, 04:39 PM
 
Location: Western Nebraskansas
2,707 posts, read 5,357,657 times
Reputation: 2415
ah. I see.

It is deliberate.
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Old 05-05-2010, 05:06 PM
 
Location: I think my user name clarifies that.
8,293 posts, read 23,165,383 times
Reputation: 3889
Quote:
Originally Posted by itsMeFred View Post
ah. I see.

It is deliberate.
Yes, I am deliberately, relentlessly exposing lies.

I am, for instance, repeatedly proving that the "we can't visit people in the hospital" claim is an absolute lie. Period.

I fail to see how certain gays absolutely refuse to see the obvious. You simply cannot lie repeatedly without losing personal credibility and doing damage to your cause.


That lie having been exposed, shall we move on to the lie that gay people cannot will their estates to anyone they wish?
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Old 05-05-2010, 05:37 PM
 
8,180 posts, read 11,286,804 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Omaha Rocks View Post
So you, as a BOYFRIEND, can't make major medical decisions for somebody.

Big whoop.

If you weren't gay and you had a girlfriend instead of a boyfriend, you STILL couldn't make major medical decisions for that person. Why? Because you're a BOYFRIEND. Guess what champ. If my adult daughter is in the hospital for some reason, it will NOT be her BOYFRIEND making major medical decisions for her. It will be her PARENTS.


And didn't you say he's not your BOYFRIEND anymore? That alone makes your whole argument a moot point.
But don't you see --- they can never be anything else but a boyfriend/girlfriend. They can never have legal rights that marriage brings to the table.
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Old 05-05-2010, 07:26 PM
 
Location: Northeast NE
696 posts, read 1,499,034 times
Reputation: 283
On the contrary, because I'm straight, my marriage is legally recognized.
Because I'm straight, I'm my husband's next of kin.
Because I'm straight I'm allowed to make medical decisions for my spouse.

THOSE RIGHTS ARE DENIED TO GAY PARTNERS.


Because I'm straight, my marriage is legally recognized. IF I AM MARRIED
Because I'm straight, I'm my husband's/wife's next of kin. IF I AM MARRIED
Because I'm straight or gay I'm allowed to make medical decisions for my spouse IF I WAS MARRIED. (if gay married in a state that recognizes it)

So with all these IFs it never covers a boyfriend/girlfriend/partner regardless if you are straight or gay.

As a straight man I would be denied to see or make life/death decisions for my girlfriend. So I would need medical power of attorney.

You may say "at least you can get married", well you can also.
Just go visit a state that allows gay marriage and get married.

Getting married is a different state is done and recognized.
For example in Nebraska first cousins can't marry, but they can drive up to South Dakota, get married and be recognized as married in Nebraska.
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Old 05-05-2010, 08:02 PM
 
Location: I think my user name clarifies that.
8,293 posts, read 23,165,383 times
Reputation: 3889
Quote:
Originally Posted by camping! View Post
But don't you see --- they can never be anything else but a boyfriend/girlfriend. They can never have legal rights that marriage brings to the table.
So the same-sex marriages in Iowa are a sham? A complete joke?


I'd also like to have it shown - with evidence - what all these "marriage benefits" are that gays are denied. Is it cheaper taxes? Nope. Is it insurance coverage? Nope. Insurance companies deny coverage to anybody they want. Is it power of attorney? Nope. That's a matter of doing the proper paper work. Is it being able to pass on your estate to your spouse? Nope. Regardless of who is involved, a proper will has to be done.
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Old 05-05-2010, 08:59 PM
 
299 posts, read 486,391 times
Reputation: 416
Default privileges/responsibilities .. two sides of same coin .......

Don't most, if not all, states have something called a " civil union " which gays can enter into .. which gives them the legal rights of a spouse?. Its not called a marriage, but then I think marriage is a religious term which carried over to the secular arena.. So even though you couldn't call your union a marriage, you'd still be legally joined.. And I expect there's some type of card or paper you could have in your wallet, which would vouch for your situation, and gain you access into the hospital's restricted areas..

But don't forget .. while a boyfriend or girlfriend aren't allowed into emergency situations, or intensive care areas .. and also can't make medical decisions for the sick person .. if the sick person should die .. the wife takes on the responsibility for his medical bills, which will probably be very expensive.. As a boyfriend or girlfriend .. even if you THINK of yourselves as married .. you are not legally responsible for your partners medical debt.. And that is a MAJOR difference.. What would your feelings be now if they had given you spousal access and authority.. and your friend had died.. and you suddenly found yourself with a 100,000 dollar debt on your hands.. Are you saying you'd accept the debt and make payments on it for the next 10 years or more.. Or would you have a lawyer telling the hospital that you weren't ACTUALLY married.. There's a flip side to every coin.. With added privilege comes added responsibility.. And I think I read that you guys aren't together anymore..

If you really want the marriage benefits .. then enter into a civil union .. and accept the responsibility that goes with it..

Not trying to give you a hard time .. just saying you can't have the benefits without the responsibility.. If you really want to be together .. then you probably have options .. and just not being able to call it a marriage shouldn't stop you.. Its the relationship, both emotional and civil, that should matter the most.. shouldn't it ?

I know there are countless other aspects .. insurance, company benefits, etc.. But that wasn't what the discussion was about.. And assuring access during emergency situations seems to me like it should be a relationship priority.. Everything else can be worked out some other way, on its own time..

And, once again, I'm not trying to give you a hard time.. But this thought came to mind while reading the previous posts..

tiberius
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