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Old 05-14-2018, 02:59 PM
 
Location: From the Middle East of the USA
565 posts, read 538,426 times
Reputation: 471

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Quote:
Originally Posted by rstevens62 View Post
What I find strange about this, back when Jesus walked the earth, he had to show proof of who he claimed to be quite often, and even his disciples always wanted more proof, another miracle healing, etc etc. and Jesus did all kind of crazy supernatural things, raising people from the dead, healing them on the spot, etc and people still didnt believe him...


...And yet 2000+yrs later, God expects the people now to believe without any proof?? Why did he think this would happen when people living at the time of Jesus didnt believe it... when they saw it first hand?!!

Its also strange to me that Jesus was willing to demonstrate his abilities to back up his claim to the people back then, but he will not do the same today?

If he really wanted people to believe in him with faith, why did he even perform any miracles when he walked the earth? Why didnt he demand those people JUST believe and JUST have faith he is who he claims to be, without any proof or supernatural acts?
If you want to believe in me, I first have to believe in me. In other words, Jesus believed He was the Son of God. No question about that. Now he needed the disciples to believe in Him. That's why he did the miracles. They all got to a point where they believed He was God, just as Jesus believed He is God.

Now, they went out and started spreading the gospel. They preached and lived and believed what they were proclaiming to the point that they died for their faith.

That's a principle. He got to believe in what you sale before you can sale it effectively.
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Old 05-14-2018, 03:24 PM
 
5,808 posts, read 1,577,647 times
Reputation: 880
Quote:
Originally Posted by hickoryfan View Post
If you want to believe in me, I first have to believe in me. In other words, Jesus believed He was the Son of God. No question about that. Now he needed the disciples to believe in Him. That's why he did the miracles. They all got to a point where they believed He was God, just as Jesus believed He is God.

Now, they went out and started spreading the gospel. They preached and lived and believed what they were proclaiming to the point that they died for their faith.

That's a principle. He got to believe in what you sale before you can sale it effectively.
God believed he was God so that meant he could do miracles?
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Old 05-14-2018, 03:41 PM
 
Location: Florida
2,303 posts, read 550,233 times
Reputation: 639
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Last Amalekite 1Sam15 View Post
If there IS a god, that knows everything including if I am going to heaven or hell before I am born, what difference would it make if omnigod has me slated for hell?

Nothing I can do to change omnigods mind, right?
Knowing where you'll end up and controlling where you'll end up are two different things. He knows where you'll end up because of the choices you'll make just like I know that if you walk off a cliff, you'll fall to the ground.
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Old 05-14-2018, 04:01 PM
 
3,288 posts, read 1,425,643 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoCardinals View Post

But I do have a question for you - what other alternative proofs and evidences you think should’ve been available besides “The Book”?
How does the message of God reach those who cannot read, write or hear or speak or cannot comprehend any language or even think ?
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Old 05-14-2018, 04:11 PM
 
5,808 posts, read 1,577,647 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shanv3 View Post
How does the message of God reach those who cannot read, write or hear or speak or cannot comprehend any language or even think ?
It doesn't.

Romans 10:14-17 "How then will they call on him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard?3 And how are they to hear without someone preaching? 15*And how are they to preach unless they are sent? As it is written, “How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the good news!” 16*But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed what he has heard from us?” 17*So faith comes from hearing, and hearing through the word of Christ."
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Old 05-14-2018, 04:21 PM
 
3,288 posts, read 1,425,643 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoCardinals View Post
Not sure if Budhism relates to OP as Budhism does not seem to worry too much about proof and evidence of God’s existence. The OP seems to relate to Abrahamic faiths but please do enlighten us in a short summary.

Is there a concept of God in Budhism who created you?
If yes, what’s the purpose of your life that budhist God created you for ?
If you know the purpose of your creation by the Budhist God, how did the message of your God came to you? Through “a book” or by verbal Chinese gossip?
And finally, in Budhism, what’s after death?

Where you came from, what’s the purpose of your life, and where are you going from here? Plz answer in the light of Buddhism.
Most of these questions can be answered in one word - PARENTS.

Bappie keeps saying God chose him, you say you got the message and pheta gives his pitch. This "chosen" thing is decided by accident and to whom we are born to. The Religion was shoved upon us by the family , when we had no idea about what we were doing. And later you use that faith, intelligence or logic afterwards to convince others that you or your path is right.

But my real question is, do we need that "message" to love or be kind??
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Old 05-14-2018, 04:24 PM
 
5,808 posts, read 1,577,647 times
Reputation: 880
Quote:
Originally Posted by shanv3 View Post
Most of these questions can be answered in one word - PARENTS.

Bappie keeps saying God chose him, you say you got the message and pheta gives his pitch. This "chosen" thing is decided by accident and to whom we are born to. The Religion was shoved upon us by the family , when we had no idea about what we were doing. And later you use that faith, intelligence or logic afterwards to convince others that you or your path is right.

But my real question is, do we need that "message" to love or be kind??
In a word: Yes.

Take a hard look at the world. People are not naturally nice. They're mean. Our hearts are naturally wicked...it's who we are.
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Old 05-14-2018, 04:29 PM
Status: "Partially gruntled." (set 10 days ago)
 
Location: Ontario, Canada
24,963 posts, read 12,914,964 times
Reputation: 11419
Quote:
Originally Posted by shanv3 View Post
Most of these questions can be answered in one word - PARENTS.

Bappie keeps saying God chose him, you say you got the message and pheta gives his pitch. This "chosen" thing is decided by accident and to whom we are born to. The Religion was shoved upon us by the family , when we had no idea about what we were doing. And later you use that faith, intelligence or logic afterwards to convince others that you or your path is right.

But my real question is, do we need that "message" to love or be kind??

Of course not. Animals show love and kindness and none of them have read a bible or Koran.



Fundies, whether Christian or Muslim, at least realize they have no inner moral compass like the rest of us. They need theirs imposed by a scary god-thing.


Weird that they brag about it.
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Old 05-14-2018, 04:32 PM
 
3,288 posts, read 1,425,643 times
Reputation: 2399
Quote:
Originally Posted by BaptistFundie View Post
It doesn't.

Romans 10:14-17 "How then will they call on him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard?3 And how are they to hear without someone preaching? 15*And how are they to preach unless they are sent? As it is written, “How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the good news!” 16*But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed what he has heard from us?” 17*So faith comes from hearing, and hearing through the word of Christ."
Thanks ,my question was about people with disabilities than non believers . They need assistance more than the message.

Where I come from, there are several Church based hospitals and schools which exclusively work/serve with disabled people and I am tahnkful for them.
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Old 05-14-2018, 06:07 PM
 
4,089 posts, read 1,500,634 times
Reputation: 1353
Quote:
Originally Posted by personne View Post
This is an absurd basis. If there is no afterlife or god, you won't fnd out anything. Good thing is : you won't even know it
Fair enough.
However I still have those as my last thoughts that I tried to live a good and peaceful life - before the curtain falls on my eyes.
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