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They are fully descriptive of God... both of them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD
But you are using our ignorant ancient ancestors' beliefs about God to interpret what that means. You insist that Holy must mean He is Just and you impose human concepts of justice involving punishment on God's justice. But the human concepts of justice are based on wrath and vengeance and punishment because we are flawed and have no other recourse down here.
To our ancient ancestors, God is the cause of everything that ever happens, including their own decisions and actions. They saw God as wrathful and vengeful and needing to be appeased by blood sacrifices. That context cannot be ignored when reading how they wrote things. Our carnal-minded ancestors considered all negative consequences as the result of God's wrath and judgment, even if it was what they did, period.
They did not lie about it in the scriptures. They just could not see it any other way. They did not know any better. To them, God had all the same emotions as we do, hate, anger, desire for vengeance, justice, etc. Therefore, when explaining the existence of any negative spiritual consequences they received as inspirations they would automatically interpret them as judgments and punishments imposed by God.
I am using the means by which God revealed Himself. You don't God has no control over the Word of God that He puts out... through men under the power of the Holy Spirit?
We are made in His image. Our desire for justice comes from Him. We may not always get it right, but the desire for dealing with bad behavior and sin comes from Him. Even in Romans 13, government is a minister of God to deal with people who do wrong. It could be corrective... it could be the death penalty.
I am using the means by which God revealed Himself. You don't God has no control over the Word of God that He puts out... through men under the power of the Holy Spirit?
We are made in His image. Our desire for justice comes from Him. We may not always get it right, but the desire for dealing with bad behavior and sin comes from Him. Even in Romans 13, government is a minister of God to deal with people who do wrong. It could be corrective... it could be the death penalty.
Our desire for justice does come from God but our wrath and desire for vengeance comes from our inability to achieve justice in our flawed world, so we use punishment. ONLY God can achieve true justice and balance the scales in ALL directions - perpetrators and victims - to undo the injustice. We cannot.
Our desire for justice does come from God but our wrath and desire for vengeance comes from our inability to achieve justice in our flawed world, so we use punishment. ONLY God can achieve true justice and balance the scales in ALL directions - perpetrators and victims - to undo the injustice. We cannot.
And how does God mete out His justice? How does that work?
If you would bother to actually read my posts instead of chiding them with blah, blah, blah, etc. you might actually learn something, BF.
They're all the same thing. I've read all you have to say a long time ago, and you're like a broken record, repeating it over and over again. The day you say something new is the day I'll really pay attention to them.
Our desire for justice does come from God but our wrath and desire for vengeance comes from our inability to achieve justice in our flawed world, so we use punishment. ONLY God can achieve true justice and balance the scales in ALL directions - perpetrators and victims - to undo the injustice. We cannot.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DRob4JC
And how does God mete out His justice? How does that work?
To begin with, your use of the phrase "mete out" suggests your human concept of justice demanding punishment. God is not limited to our human methods. He can see to it that the perpetrator experiences EXACTLY whatever they have dished out and that the victims experience an equivalent restoration, something we cannot do on earth.
To begin with, your use of the phrase "mete out" suggests your human concept of justice demanding punishment. God is not limited to our human methods. He can see to it that the perpetrator experiences EXACTLY whatever they have dished out and that the victims experience an equivalent restoration, something we cannot do on earth.
Did you come up with that yourself, or is that in the Bible somewhere?
Did you come up with that yourself, or is that in the Bible somewhere?
Reaping what we sow would seem to support the perpetrators' fates and God's agape love would suggest that He would NOT let the victims' situation stand unrecompensed.
Reaping what we sow would seem to support the perpetrators' fates and God's agape love would suggest that He would NOT let the victims' situation stand unrecompensed.
That's not justice. Reaping and sowing is not justice. It's the fruit of one behavior - good or bad.
What does God do with the perpetrator who sows bad deeds?
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