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That's not justice. Reaping and sowing is not justice. It's the fruit of one behavior - good or bad.
What does God do with the perpetrator who sows bad deeds?
What could be more just or equitable than to end up experiencing what you have inflicted on others from the receiving end? You are getting exactly what you dished out as many times as you dished it out. Imagine Hitler having to experience every single one of the more than 6 million (or more) tortures and deaths he was responsible for! That would take a while!
I am using the means by which God revealed Himself. You don't God has no control over the Word of God that He puts out... through men under the power of the Holy Spirit?
We are made in His image. Our desire for justice comes from Him. We may not always get it right, but the desire for dealing with bad behavior and sin comes from Him. Even in Romans 13, government is a minister of God to deal with people who do wrong. It could be corrective... it could be the death penalty.
no we are not in His image yet but are being made in His image and the death penalty is corrective.
Adam had no law. For over two thousand years, there was no law.
There is no law in effect today because Christ died to the law.
Adam did have the law given in the form of the tree of knowledge of good and evil and the law is still in operation today as none have yet been made in the image and likeness of God except Jesus.
Gen 1:26 - human beings were originally made in His image. We have the imprints of God in us.
Not according to Paul who said we as of right now bare the image of the first man Adam, which is of the earth earthy, but we shall bare the image of the Heavenly which is the image of God as seen in Christ Jesus.
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Not sure where you get the death penalty being corrective.
because the law is a ministration of death and yet our schoolmaster that leads us to Christ.
Not according to Paul who said we as of right now bare the image of the first man Adam, which is of the earth earthy, but we shall bare the image of the Heavenly which is the image of God as seen in Christ Jesus.
We are in Adam's image. Adam's was made in God's image before he sinned.
Genesis 5:1 - This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day when God created man, He made him in the likeness of God.
telling everyone that Jesus is a failure is not exalting Jesus
Paul call your doctrine a doctrine of devils, so I at least stand on good ground to also say it.
Where in the Bible did Paul call the doctrine of hell a doctrine of devils? Paul was an apostle of Jesus Christ; so I don't think he would be calling Christ's doctrine a doctrine of devils. But go ahead and give me a reference.
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Originally Posted by MysticPhD
You just ignore the context that controlled the interpretation of any inspirations from God, JBF. To our ancient ancestors, God is the cause of everything that ever happens, including their own decisions and actions. They saw Him as wrathful and vengeful and needing to be appeased by blood sacrifices. That context cannot be ignored when reading how they wrote things. To them, God had all the same emotions as we do, hate, anger, desire for vengeance, justice, etc. Therefore, explaining the existence of spiritual consequences would automatically be interpreted as judgments and punishments imposed by God.
It is that misunderstanding of God born of the early experiences described in the fables of the Bible and the Mosaic schoolmaster stage of obedience training using fear of God that had to be corrected. That is one of the reasons why Jesus was sent, NOT to pay for some ill-described "sins of mankind" or whatever. If there were a Satan, corrupting that central message of God's True Nature and Holy Spirit of agape love would be the most effective false teaching imaginable. It has certainly proved to be so for millennia.
Here may be a problem with your theology, Mystic; in that you have a different Jesus than the Jesus of the Bible (see 2 Corinthians 11:3-4). The God (Jesus) of the Bible is a personal God; and He does indeed have emotions and a will. He is not impersonal. That is more the god of the Buddhists than the God of the Bible.
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Originally Posted by MysticPhD
But you do NOT exalt our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, JBF, you exalt the Bible! You accept things in the Bible that directly contradict God's Holy Spirit of agape love as revealed and unambiguously demonstrated by our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
I do believe that God is just and that His justice is an aspect of His agape love in the way that the Lord governs the affairs of man.
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Originally Posted by MysticPhD
But you are using our ignorant ancient ancestors' beliefs about God to interpret what that means. You insist that Holy must mean He is Just and you impose human concepts of justice involving punishment on God's justice. But the human concepts of justice are based on wrath and vengeance and punishment because we are flawed and have no other recourse down here.
To our ancient ancestors, God is the cause of everything that ever happens, including their own decisions and actions. They saw God as wrathful and vengeful and needing to be appeased by blood sacrifices. That context cannot be ignored when reading how they wrote things. Our carnal-minded ancestors considered all negative consequences as the result of God's wrath and judgment, even if it was what they did, period.
They did not lie about it in the scriptures. They just could not see it any other way. They did not know any better. To them, God had all the same emotions as we do, hate, anger, desire for vengeance, justice, etc. Therefore, when explaining the existence of any negative spiritual consequences they received as inspirations they would automatically interpret them as judgments and punishments imposed by God.
A god who is not just is more like the god of the Muslims than anything else. It has been said that Allah is capricious and it should be clear that the mantra of the Muslims is that he is most merciful (and not just). Thus they feel justified in committing acts of terrorism because their understanding is that there will be no just punishment for what they are committing.
I do not believe in a god who has mercy without justice; that only provides for sinners committing heinous acts and getting away with it; such heinous acts as cause great suffering on those against whom they are committed.
My God is a God of absolute justice; and He is also able to show mercy because Jesus died on the Cross in the place of sinners.
For there are two irreconcilable attributes in the heart of God.
Justice requires that the exact punishment be meted out that is according to the due penalty.
Mercy desires that God be able to mete out less than what is deserved.
Enter the Cross. God executed justice by punishing the Lord Jesus in our place so that He could show mercy while justice will still be satisfied.
This is the doctrine of Penal Substitution; and it is the gospel of Jesus Christ.
What could be more just or equitable than to end up experiencing what you have inflicted on others from the receiving end? You are getting exactly what you dished out as many times as you dished it out. Imagine Hitler having to experience every single one of the more than 6 million (or more) tortures and deaths he was responsible for! That would take a while!
Did he?
Did Hitler experience the deaths of 6 million people?
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