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My understanding of hell is nothing but the Catholic understanding which remains unchanged since Apostolic times.
That is debatable.
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Why do you believe that the Catholic understanding of hell implies failure on the part of God?
Because God took aim at the salvation of the world,sent Jesus his arrow to save the world and according to the Catholic understanding of hell the salvation of the world cannot ever happen, thus are huge failures.thus both Father and Son missed the mark/sinned.
God's patience is perfect and could never run out. His love is also unending.
I didn't say anything about "the VAST majority of mankind", though many Saints have said that.
I don't dispute that Christ is the Savior of all mankind, especially to those who believe.
Do you believe that God would drag someone kicking and screaming into His presence in fellowship against their will? Do you believe that Good can have any fellowship with evil?
We're so close then....and my answer to your question is nobody in their right mind would ever, EVER reject the opportunity to fellowship in Heaven. Who kicks and screams? Think of 2 doors presented to a rational mind...door number 1=eternal bliss and happiness. Door number 2= sadness and suffering. So your saying some people would pick door number 2? Really? Because they hate God sooo much? Laughable.
Because God took aim at the salvation of the world,sent Jesus his arrow to save the world and according to the Catholic understanding of hell the salvation of the world cannot ever happen, thus are huge failures.thus both Father and Son missed the mark/sinned.
I disagree with how you characterize God's plan and salvific work.
God did not create us as automatons. We have free will. Man's free choice to reject Him is not a failure on God's part.
The salvation of the world is a work in progress that will not be fulfilled until the consummation; but it will be accomplished.
This is where logic stops for them. They know this but it does not reconcile with what they have indoctrinated with. Quite a catch 22.
How much are they REALLY bothered by it though? Jimmie says he preaches to the lost but how many respond but thats not his job either. But, trillions of years is a loong time. No escape, just forever, in torment. Too painful to think about so they move on, in denial really.
ya it seem logic gets placed aside in favor of doctrine.
Mike that is good but you need to take it within, the old man and the new man, the soulish man and the spiritual man, the terrestrial body and the celestial body. it is the old man nature that suffers in the presence of God mike all the while he is being destroyed the inner man/new man is in joy of his birth in the presence of God.
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Originally Posted by EscAlaMike
Where did you learn this doctrine?
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Originally Posted by pneuma
it is all through the new testament mike, mostly via Paul.
It seems like your unique interpretation of Paul, as it's not an interpretation I've ever heard before in either Catholic or Protestant theology; at least certainly not in mainstream circles.
I disagree with how you characterize God's plan and salvific work.
God did not create us as automatons. We have free will. Man's free choice to reject Him is not a failure on God's part.
Mike we do not have a freewill choice of life or death until AFTER we have been regenerated, we were SLAVES to sin and death, but once regenerated and the regeneration is ALL of God we are given the freewill choice of life or death.
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The salvation of the world is a work in progress that will not be fulfilled until the consummation; but it will be accomplished.
I agree, however that seem like lip service to me because the salvation of the world can never happen if people are eternally torment.
Because God took aim at the salvation of the world,sent Jesus his arrow to save the world and according to the Catholic understanding of hell the salvation of the world cannot ever happen, thus are huge failures.thus both Father and Son missed the mark/sinned.
What if your understanding of that was wrong?
You believe God is a failure? That he can fail?
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