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Old 10-13-2019, 03:26 PM
 
21,382 posts, read 7,954,715 times
Reputation: 18156

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Quote:
Originally Posted by suzy_q2010 View Post
Hypertension, diabetes, and renal failure are all chronic medical problems. Do you think their treatment provides "no immediate and necessary, very clear purpose"?

The people who have those conditions would beg to differ with you.
What is T R A U MA care?

Do you know? Do you UNDERSTAND the difference between CHRONIC CARE and TRAUMA CARE? Hint .. has to do with that pesky word IMMEDIATE.

But no.. Apparently not. And that, again, is NMP.

That's why, again, YOU are not a doctor.

 
Old 10-13-2019, 03:32 PM
 
20,955 posts, read 8,687,712 times
Reputation: 14050
Quote:
Originally Posted by AADAD View Post
The discoveries of medical therapies have saved so many millions of lives, prevented horrible deaths and cured blindness and other illnesses. SMALLPOX, POLIO, .
George Washington took smallpox vaccine.

As has been explained, Polio was the result of government and non-profit and other such funding. No Pharma company made billions on it.

You need to be very clear when speaking about such things.

Now, if you want the best example use Opiates. A natural substance that will end up costing the USA 100's of billions or trillions...much of which went into the pockets of Big Pharma and other commercial enterprises.

I'm not doubting that advances have been made. But you don't simply put a "one size fits all" measurement of profits as being the cause of this. In fact, the very opposite is true. The last real mass death situation in the USA was the Flu epidemic of 1918. This was solved largely by public health champions including the Rockefeller Foundation and quite a few others. NONE of those researchers even made a MILLION dollars, let alone many billions.

Please - explain that very slowly to me so I can understand....why giving them Billion was something I should accept as normal???

Oh, DNA and the Human Genome. Another Big Government project, although Craig V. worked a lot of it out with academic and other money. It would have never happened at the speed it did without the US Government doing it...

"After the idea was picked up in 1984 by the US government when the planning started, the project formally launched in 1990 and was declared complete on April 14, 2003.[3] Funding came from the US government through the National Institutes of Health (NIH) as well as numerous other groups from around the world."

AIDS?
Thank Paris and the US institutes of health....
"We began conducting this research at the National Institutes of Health in Bethesda and at the Pasteur Institute in Paris. "

So, instead of "thanking the billionaires", I'm going to thank those tireless individuals who work in PUBLIC HEALTH which has formed the foundation for most everything we are discussing.
 
Old 10-13-2019, 03:46 PM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
37,119 posts, read 41,299,979 times
Reputation: 45183
Quote:
Originally Posted by newtovenice View Post
What is T R A U MA care?

Do you know? Do you UNDERSTAND the difference between CHRONIC CARE and TRAUMA CARE? Hint .. has to do with that pesky word IMMEDIATE.

But no.. Apparently not. And that, again, is NMP.

That's why, again, YOU are not a doctor.
I am just wondering why you think that chronic medical conditions should not be treated.

Malignant hypertension, for example, carries an IMMEDIATE risk of stroke.
 
Old 10-13-2019, 03:51 PM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
37,119 posts, read 41,299,979 times
Reputation: 45183
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
George Washington took smallpox vaccine.

As has been explained, Polio was the result of government and non-profit and other such funding. No Pharma company made billions on it.

You need to be very clear when speaking about such things.

Now, if you want the best example use Opiates. A natural substance that will end up costing the USA 100's of billions or trillions...much of which went into the pockets of Big Pharma and other commercial enterprises.

I'm not doubting that advances have been made. But you don't simply put a "one size fits all" measurement of profits as being the cause of this. In fact, the very opposite is true. The last real mass death situation in the USA was the Flu epidemic of 1918. This was solved largely by public health champions including the Rockefeller Foundation and quite a few others. NONE of those researchers even made a MILLION dollars, let alone many billions.

Please - explain that very slowly to me so I can understand....why giving them Billion was something I should accept as normal???

Oh, DNA and the Human Genome. Another Big Government project, although Craig V. worked a lot of it out with academic and other money. It would have never happened at the speed it did without the US Government doing it...

"After the idea was picked up in 1984 by the US government when the planning started, the project formally launched in 1990 and was declared complete on April 14, 2003.[3] Funding came from the US government through the National Institutes of Health (NIH) as well as numerous other groups from around the world."

AIDS?
Thank Paris and the US institutes of health....
"We began conducting this research at the National Institutes of Health in Bethesda and at the Pasteur Institute in Paris. "

So, instead of "thanking the billionaires", I'm going to thank those tireless individuals who work in PUBLIC HEALTH which has formed the foundation for most everything we are discussing.
George Washington had already had smallpox, leaving him with noticeable scars. He knew he was immune and did not have to be vaccinated.

Could you please tell us how many billionaires you are talking about?
 
Old 10-13-2019, 04:11 PM
 
1,500 posts, read 887,774 times
Reputation: 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by old_cold View Post
What?? I thought this HGH was doing it for you??
Why still taking ibufrofen at any level?
I did, BTW, check online, since I'd like to give you the benefit of the doubt.
Whoa! Mostly a MLM product! Are you getting cheaper from a reliable source??
Yes..her daughter is the source! Surprise
 
Old 10-13-2019, 04:28 PM
 
1,203 posts, read 619,316 times
Reputation: 874
The original small pox vaccine (vaccinia) was developed in the 1790s. Variolation had been around for a while before in Europe and the Americas.
George Washington had small pox and probably became sterile because of it.
The actual evidence about antioxidants and cancer show they can increase the risk of certain cancers. This is a very famous study, the select trial. They stopped it early because of the risk.
 
Old 10-14-2019, 05:25 AM
 
59,111 posts, read 27,349,464 times
Reputation: 14290
Quote:
Originally Posted by newtovenice View Post
There is a HUGE difference between care for a trauma (example: car accident) and chronic disease management.

Trauma care is lifesaving and functional. It serves an immediate and necessary, very clear purpose.
Same medical profession, medicines and equipment suppliers. Don't bad mouth them then beg them to keep you aloive.
 
Old 10-14-2019, 05:42 AM
 
21,382 posts, read 7,954,715 times
Reputation: 18156
Quote:
Originally Posted by suzy_q2010 View Post
I am just wondering why you think that chronic medical conditions should not be treated.

Malignant hypertension, for example, carries an IMMEDIATE risk of stroke.
Goal posts moved. Again./shrug/
 
Old 10-14-2019, 05:43 AM
 
10,237 posts, read 6,327,985 times
Reputation: 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quick Enough View Post
The next time you or any member of ypur fsamily is sick, have alife threatening accident, diagnosed with cancer, etc. do NOT go to a doctor or take ANY of their pills.


Me thinks you would be hypocrite and BEG for their help!
Not everyone. My uncle was told he needed surgery to save his life or he would be dead in 6 months. He got dressed, and walked out of the hospital. He died 8 months later at home. Uncle was 69.

A friend of ours recently was diagnosed with cancer. His wife found him in their bedroom with a bullet in his brain. He left a note saying he did not want to go through cancer treatment. He was 70.

A few months ago, I started feeling very dizzy and collapsed on my bathroom floor. All I wanted to do was sleep. My husband asked me if I wanted him to call 911. I have an Advanced Directive. Husband, and my children, know how I feel. I told him no just get me a pillow. Slept on the bathroom floor for 10 hours. Obviously, I'm still here. If that was how I going was to die, than so be it. I won't know what caused that because I do not go to doctors, and didn't for that. I am 71.

Do you really believe everyone is going to beg for help? You need to respect others choices even if they do not agree with yours, and that includes your own family members.
 
Old 10-14-2019, 06:27 AM
 
10,237 posts, read 6,327,985 times
Reputation: 11290
I know people don't anecdotal stories, but this one is relevant to OT. Hubs's Coworkers son was first diagnosed with cancer at 2. Years of treatments, hospitals, including traveling to St. Jude's.

At 11 the boy said No More. He told his parents if he could not be a normal boy, that he wanted to go home and die in his own bed surrounded by this family and dog.

His Dad told us the doctors said they were trying to keep him alive long enough for a cure to be found. He also said that he realized that he was being selfish trying to keep his son alive against his wishes. The family stopped all treatment, and brought the child home where he did pass away in a few months.


Remember, this was a child and not an elderly adult. Do you think that this family should not have the right to stop treatment when he could not be cured at a specific time? CPS should have been called?

My Mom wrote in her Living Will, "I do not wish to become a science experiment so doctors can see how long they can keep me alive." "Let me go." Mom was an adult and could make this decision herself.

Would you force cancer treatment on a child? For how long? Nine years isn't long enough? Who is this about? The patient, or the doctors?
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