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The difference is that those who do carry that huuuuuuuuge list of grievances do so because of what religion has done to them.
That huuuuuuuuge list of grievances that some theists have is that atheists simply post on the internet. How militant of us. Hence the other thread about why theists are fascinated by atheists. Why do some fundamentalist theists want us to be quiet?
That's only the insecure ones. Some of us genuinely want to hear others' points of view. I never understood any of the atheist posts to be "grievances".
Who is the we that are being asked ANYTHING? WE, the spiritual and believers, DO NOT CARE what you accept or or not accept. You are not even in the periphery of our consciousness. We simply wish you would not be so loud and intrusive.
As for sharing your knowledge with us, you can't. You have nothing to share that we don't already know. Some atheists seem to believe we don't know science. They forget, in denial, or simply in ignorance, that many scientist are also religious. Spirituality has no conflict with Science, none. It honors all knowledge. Knowing is Divinity.
Neither does Science have any conflict with spirituality. Science does not PROVE anything. It observes, measures, and formulates a theory. Science libraries abound with theories that have not worked out. Scientists have been discredited Science accepts there are somethings it simply does not know.
And yet you do all that posting. I'd hate to think how much you'd post if you did care!
Only those who haven't understood what they were reading in the Bible.
That's what we were taught, growing up. "If you don't do this, and you do this, and you don't follow this, but you follow that, you're going to hell!!!!"
I was an atheist for some time, starting in my childhood. I had stolen a quarter from my brother, and there's the preacher on Sunday giving a sermon about how we would go to hell if we stole anything. Well, what's the point then? I'm 8 years old, and it's already over for me.
I eventually went to agnostic - which was really still unbelieving, but wondering if maybe?
In 2020, I became a Christian. I was just looking things up because the Bible made no sense to me...not how I was taught in church that we were forced to go to every Sunday.
But one day, I found a 3 + hour long video going over Genesis to Revelation. For the first time, it all made sense. And then I found more and more who were teaching the same way. I even bought my very first Bible, ever.
No, there are no contradictions, people aren't reading it correctly. The Gentiles were not, and are not, under the law. The law was for the descendants of Abraham, not 'everyone'.
It wasn't until Paul (Saul) came along that things changed for those who were not the Jews. And, in most books of the Bible, you learn WHO the disciples are talking to. Hint: Not the gentiles.
Paul said he had a vision, immediately changed his ways, and spent the rest of his life telling people about Jesus, and the FREE GIFT of salvation. 'The Church' is not 'the Jews' from the Old Testament nor when Jesus was still walking around on the earth.
The entire Bible is FOR you, but the entire Bible is not TO you.
Most preachers/priests/ministers do what they were taught in school: Jump around the Bible, pick out versus here and there, and claim that they are for 'everyone' to follow. That's simply not true.
If you're gay, it does not mean you're going to hell.
If you murder someone, it does not mean you're going to hell.
If you're a liar, a thief, an adulterer, etc, it does not mean you're going to hell.
There is one reason, and one reason only for that, and all anyone has to do is accept it, believe it, and that's it. That is literally it.
Now, not going to say that was easy - because it's not. I don't have faith in dang near anything. I don't have faith in people, I don't have faith that I will just be here tomorrow - anything can happen - I don't have faith that everything will work out - I hope. I've always relied on 'hope' more than anything.
Jesus was on this earth. Jesus was crucified. Jesus was buried. The hard part was: Resurrection. It didn't happen overnight, my faith. It took a long time.
But what took more faith than that? Believing in a 'big bang' theory. How do you have something come from nothing? You can't! If there's nothing there, there's nothing to 'bang'. And the idea that we came from single cell organisms, then turned into fish, then the fish walked out of the water, then eventually they evolved to neanderthals (of which many of those 'displays' have been debunked as fakes), that eventually evolved into man....no. That takes a whole lot more faith than anything I've read in the Bible.
God is not an angry God. He's not a mean and hateful God...which is what many are taught. It's wrong.
RELIGION is a big, fat problem because people use it to try to control others. The Bible - no, it's not trying to control others, like so many believe. It's telling you a story, from beginning to future end. Everyone, right now, including the Jews, already have salvation locked up by doing one simple thing: Accept and believe that Jesus was alive, crucified, buried, and resurrected. The majority of the world, including scientists, say that Jesus did walk this earth. They agree he was crucified. They agree he was buried. The problem comes in when people argue if Jesus was the son of God, and whether or not he 'resurrected'.
That's literally it.
And you will know which 'Christians' haven't read their Bibles because they will argue until the cows come home, that the entire Bible is TO us. They always throw out versus from all over the place in the Bible, including the Old Testament, as their 'proof'.
They will say the exact same thing to those who understand the Dispensation of Grace as they do the atheists. 'You just want an excuse to sin!' What is sin? What laws were the Gentiles given? They weren't given any laws. Being a better person benefits YOU! A lot of those laws that people follow are not to 'control you', it's to make your life a whole lot easier without all the drama. You don't tend to get into trouble when you don't steal, don't murder, don't go having flings with people who are not your spouse, etc.
They are wrong. Just sit down and read it, front to back, even the boring 'begats' and the nauseating Leviticus. Just do it. Pay attention to who is talking to who, WHEN, and why.
Most people don't do that.
The biggest scam ever perpetrated onto the people, past, present, and future, is using the Bible to tell them that everything they do is wrong, God is angry, and everyone is going to burn in hell. It's. Not. True!
Quote:
Originally Posted by LookinForMayberry
The forum title is "Religion & Spirituality." A large contingent of people have a deep, abiding spiritual connection to God, myself included, but are abhorred by how organized religion has descended into something that has nothing to do with any of their origins.
My God is too big to fit into such a small, petty group of people who seem more concerned with foisting their world views on others. God is omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent. There is nowhere that God is not, and we all have our very existence in that presence I call God. Others call this Universal Consciousness by other names. Regardless of the term of identification, across all the original "religions" the basic message was the same. Love all others as you would wish to be loved. God loves us all, and holds no special attachment to one over another. Present day religions have no indication of this in any of them. God doesn't fight wars, grant special favors.
Every so often, one of us -- like me, now, come here to try to open others hearts to the true belief: We are all one in God. There is no "they."
Both these posts are demonstrative of a beautiful witness.
We really are "All one in God"...we always have been, and always will be...no matter what.
I just want to thank ThreeWolvesInSnow and LookinforMayberry for their beautiful posts. They were a pleasure to read.
Yesterday I was ready to leave this forum.
I was so sick and tired of the supposed spiritual people picking holes, pointing fingers and throwing insults. It seems that's what this forum had been reduced to .
You two, on the other hand are shining examples of humanity.
I'm not on the same page with either of you but I appreciate what you both wrote, non judgemental, no nastiness, just sharing your worldview. This is what this forum should be about.
The topic of the thread is “why skeptics and atheists post here and in other religious threads?” It is possible the topic offends you. But it is a valid question.
The two posts you have commented on are response to religion and spirituality. You have quoted those as an excuse for picking holes, pointing fingers, and throwing insults at other posters, and expressing nastiness and being judgmental.
I come back after a month and the first thread is some other rant about why we atheists are posting here?
Are you <<bleep>> KIDDING ME?
This is why I have warned people from DAY ONE how fascistic believers tend to be. They don't care about anyone else's opinions - or their right to express them. They want to live in their own little Mutual Backpatting Society where ne'er a discourging word is said about their religion.
Heaven forbid if their narrative is broken.
Oh, and Tzephkiel or whatever your name is - yes - I saw your snide little responses to my posts. "Another rant" lol. That's what you said.
And it's funny because you walked right into my minefield showing literally EVERYONE who read my post how 100% correct I am in calling people like you to the carpet.
Jesus Tapdancing Christ, I'm a better Christian than the whole lot of you. Something tells me that if your God really exists, it's not me who will be dancing on the end of a pitchfork.
A truly good, loving, compassionate, and understanding god wouldn't get all worked up if people like me doubted or disbelieved in his existence - just so said argument can divide humanity and cause everything from open warfare to just plain bad behavior from ... people like Tzeph - one of the most outright rudest posters on this forum.
A truly good, loving, compassionate, and understanding god wouldn't want people like Tzeph to act in the manner that he/she/it or whatever the hell does to me and probably others here. That smug, dismissive attitude. He/she/it or whatever the hell could simply not read my posts - or if she does read them - could simply not bother to leave a comment.
But oh no ... nooooo ... she has to leave a stupid little snide remark that doesn't do ANYTHING except create animosity. These are the people who throw the stones into the placid waters getting a kick out of watching the ripples of boorishness permeate throughout the forum. I don't sit here and attack other posters - at least, I didn't at first. Now, I really don't give a <<bleep>>. Even getting my ass banned doesn't deter me from rubbing their noses in the crap they leave on the carpet.
Last edited by mensaguy; 07-09-2022 at 06:56 PM..
Reason: language.
The topic of the thread is “why skeptics and atheists post here and in other religious threads?” It is possible the topic offends you. But it is a valid question.
The two posts you have commented on are response to religion and spirituality. You have quoted those as an excuse for picking holes, pointing fingers, and throwing insults at other posters, and expressing nastiness and being judgmental.
No, it's not a valid question.
At all.
No one has yet to provide an adequate answer to the question that IS valid:
Why SHOULDN'T we be posting here?
What makes you think that the R&S forum belongs to you exclusively?
Because I really don't see any mods telling us not to post here or that we're in the wrong forum.
So people like you can pretend to be little authoritarian fascistic dictators - but you're not mods.
I would point out that this IS a forum about religion and spirituatlity.
It is NOT a forum about whether or not people like me are allowed to post here. If the mods are not kicking us out of here, then guess what.
You have already lost.
So knock it off with your ranting about us being here. Live with it. Because I honestly don't give a flying intercourse whether you like it or not. If I want to post here, I'm going to post here. Period.
No one has yet to provide an adequate answer to the question that IS valid:
Why SHOULDN'T we be posting here?
What makes you think that the R&S forum belongs to you exclusively?
Because I really don't see any mods telling us not to post here or that we're in the wrong forum.
So people like you can pretend to be little authoritarian fascistic dictators - but you're not mods.
I would point out that this IS a forum about religion and spirituatlity.
It is NOT a forum about whether or not people like me are allowed to post here. If the mods are not kicking us out of here, then guess what.
You have already lost.
So knock it off with your ranting about us being here. Live with it. Because I honestly don't give a flying intercourse whether you like it or not. If I want to post here, I'm going to post here. Period.
Flying intercourse? That is testing my imagination.
The topic is not about should or should not. But why.
Are you offering your thoughts on your religion and spirituality?
Wait, you thought the thoughts about religions and spirituality was all for you? You poor thing. No wonder you feel so attacked. They are just sharing thoughts about religion and spirituality in a forum called Religion and Spirituality. I thought pointing out the number of posts one posts was disallowed. But you may be immune to rules.
Forgive me for that specific slip.
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Hence the other thread about why theists are fascinated by atheists. Why do some fundamentalist theists want us to be quiet?
