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Old 06-26-2023, 11:01 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,154 posts, read 23,808,801 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by forsheamountain View Post
What would you do if your light switch didn't work or there was no water in your sink? Call a sociologist? Lmfao.
And what would you do if you had stomach cancer? Call a plumber?
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Old 06-27-2023, 12:00 AM
 
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
34,565 posts, read 57,493,759 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
And what would you do if you had stomach cancer? Call a plumber?
In the USA, it's pretty common just to die if you have an expensive treatment plan ahead of you. Especially if you are in the trades or self employed. Save your surviving spouse from impoverishment. Die early, die quickly. Several friends who were outsourced in their 50's snf got concer ot liver conditions exercised the 'Die' option. Especially before the ACA subsidies. ACA took away our affordable options. My post A(?) CA premiums eventully whent from a very affordable $300 / month (pre ACA) to $2800/ month post ACA. Then we became uninsured and would have had to accompany our friends on the DIE plan, rather than rack up the medical bills. Three of those friends who had to choose to die rather than treat... were plumbers.
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Old 06-27-2023, 12:54 AM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,154 posts, read 23,808,801 times
Reputation: 32540
Quote:
Originally Posted by StealthRabbit View Post
In the USA, it's pretty common just to die if you have an expensive treatment plan ahead of you. Especially if you are in the trades or self employed. Save your surviving spouse from impoverishment. Die early, die quickly. Several friends who were outsourced in their 50's snf got concer ot liver conditions exercised the 'Die' option. Especially before the ACA subsidies. ACA took away our affordable options. My post A(?) CA premiums eventully whent from a very affordable $300 / month (pre ACA) to $2800/ month post ACA. Then we became uninsured and would have had to accompany our friends on the DIE plan, rather than rack up the medical bills. Three of those friends who had to choose to die rather than treat... were plumbers.
And that has what to do with why trade school (supposedly) isn't more heavily promoted?
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Old 06-27-2023, 08:59 AM
 
12,591 posts, read 8,820,605 times
Reputation: 34426
Quote:
Originally Posted by CorporateCowboy View Post
School counselors assist students in career exploration and realistically assess the preparedness (or likelihood of success) re: the pursuit of specific career paths. To that end, vocational schools are promoted (and relevant) to some students; however, it’s nonsensical to assume they should be ‘heavily promoted’, per the thread title, amongst the general student population. Obviously, academically-elite universities aren’t ’promoted’ either; the majority of students are going to fall somewhere in the middle and/or have no idea their career choice right-off-the-bat.
That sounds like something off a become a school counselor web site. No one I know ever got any useful post high school advice from a school counselor. Even their college advice is just the generic "go to college" advice of the school system in general.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph_Kirk View Post
Of course they should be. The majority of students are not going to college. Unless other possibilities of advanced training are promoted often an early, they end up with nothing at all...which is what is happening to most high school graduates today.

Most students are not going to college and most of those not going to college are not being directed to post-secondary training.
Can't give you more points but I think you're on the key point. Ever feel like in these discussions we're talking from two different worlds and the words don't mean the same thing between the elite academic world and the real world?
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Old 06-27-2023, 09:38 AM
 
Location: San Francisco
8,444 posts, read 3,705,317 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tnff View Post
That sounds like something off a become a school counselor web site.
Any meaningful counseling is managed one-on-one; hence the point, it’s nonsensical to suggest trade schools should be ‘heavily promoted’, per the thread, amongst the general population simply because it is a viable option for some students.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tnff View Post
No one I know ever got any useful post high school advice from a school counselor.
I merely explained the point of school counselors to the poster who asked; I didn’t vouch for (the quality of) anyone’s personal experience. That said, many high-school students are apathetic re: their future (or haven’t thought it through yet) i.e. it’s a two-way street.

That said, there are a slew of career assessment tests (and student career plans) available to high-school students.
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Old 06-27-2023, 09:41 AM
 
Location: western NY
6,189 posts, read 2,976,633 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by forsheamountain View Post
What would you do if your light switch didn't work or there was no water in your sink? Call a sociologist? Lmfao.
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Old 06-27-2023, 09:42 AM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,154 posts, read 23,808,801 times
Reputation: 32540
Quote:
Originally Posted by CorporateCowboy View Post
Any meaningful counseling is managed one-on-one; hence the point, it’s nonsensical to suggest trade schools should be ‘heavily promoted’, per the thread, amongst the general population simply because it is a viable option for some students.



I merely explained the point of school counselors to the poster who asked; I didn’t vouch for (the quality of) anyone’s personal experience. That said, many high-school students are apathetic re: their future (or haven’t thought it through yet) i.e. it’s a two-way street.

That said, there are a slew of career assessment tests (and student career plans) available to high-school students.
It's also not very reasonable to expect any intense counseling at the school level. Our counselors had a load of approximately 250 students per counselor.
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Old 06-27-2023, 10:06 AM
 
Location: San Francisco
8,444 posts, read 3,705,317 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
It's also not very reasonable to expect any intense counseling at the school level. Our counselors had a load of approximately 250 students per counselor.
Who said anything about ‘intense counseling’? Career assessment tests are distributed in-class, as a whole, and guidance counselors are available/scheduled to follow-up beyond the (minimal) one-on-one time necessary for each student to enroll in their classes for the semester/year.

That said, for those who are interested in pursuing a trade or vocational school, per the thread, their high-school requirements (and need of counseling/planning relative to such) will be minimal. Hence, really, what is there to ‘promote’?
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Old 06-27-2023, 12:06 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,154 posts, read 23,808,801 times
Reputation: 32540
Quote:
Originally Posted by CorporateCowboy View Post
Who said anything about ‘intense counseling’? Career assessment tests are distributed in-class, as a whole, and guidance counselors are available/scheduled to follow-up beyond the (minimal) one-on-one time necessary for each student to enroll in their classes for the semester/year.

That said, for those who are interested in pursuing a trade or vocational school, per the thread, their high-school requirements (and need of counseling/planning relative to such) will be minimal. Hence, really, what is there to ‘promote’?
I'm not talking about in-class counseling. I'm talking about the idea of a counselor meeting with a student (and perhaps the kid's parents) one on one.
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Old 06-27-2023, 01:24 PM
 
Location: San Francisco
8,444 posts, read 3,705,317 times
Reputation: 5680
Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
I'm not talking about in-class counseling. I'm talking about the idea of a counselor meeting with a student (and perhaps the kid's parents) one on one.
That’s what I was referring to as well; hence, my point ‘scheduling’/availability. The career assessment tests, however, are typically distributed/taken in-class. Either way, ‘intensive counseling’ isn’t likely needed relative to requirements; there are limited tracks in high-school anyway. That said, of course the focus is on college prep, because it requires a more strict and demanding curriculum (from the start) i.e. (advanced levels of) foreign language, math, science and so on which are not required relative to trade or vocational schools.

Thus, what’s there to promote (or counsel) re: trade schools?
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