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This thread feels like a debate between two groups of poor working-class people. One decided to go college and wrack up debt that apparently they don’t make enough money to pay back AND those who prefer to go straight to the sweatshop and break their backs making wealthy men even wealthier.
I don’t consider it a debate in the least; no one is suggesting anyone shouldn’t go to trade school (or that it isn’t a viable option for some). Just don’t expect everyone to jump on that bandwagon by weakly implying all college students will be in considerable debt and work a dead-end job the rest of their lives, although I know it’s your ongoing personal claim re: ‘promotion’, per the thread. :-)
It’s as if you’re suggesting those who don’t plan to attend college are neglected. If there is any more time given, it’s relative to the student’s schedule (to ensure they are enrolled in the classes they need to meet certain requirements). There is no such reason to meet with a student who is considering a trade school as entrance requirements are minimal (and they have no interest in school or meeting with a guidance counselor anyway). If they did, they could; it starts with the student.
I just think an elective could help those trying to decide their path. I’m not for high schools schools teaching vocational subjects like HVAC certification, but why not what is basically an intro to the trades elective? It would not focus on any one trade, but give info on different trades and how to train for them.
As long as it’s an elective and not a requirement, I think it could be helpful to students.
I don’t consider it a debate in the least; no one is suggesting anyone shouldn’t go to trade school (or that it isn’t a viable option for some). Just don’t expect everyone to jump on that bandwagon by weakly implying all college students will be in considerable debt and work a dead-end job the rest of their lives, although I know it’s your ongoing personal claim re: ‘promotion’, per the thread. :-)
Agreed. This notion that college is only a path to debt and at best a McJob isn’t supported by facts. No, college isn’t for everyone, but there’s no denying that those with college degrees (when looking at median income) will out earn those without one and they’re less likely to be unemployed.
Just like going into a trade, college is what you make of it.
From the link:
The earnings gap between college graduates and those with less education continues to widen. In 2021, median income for recent graduates reached $52,000 a year for bachelor’s degree holders aged 22–27. For high school graduates the same age, median earnings are $30,000 a year.
Recent college graduates also weathered the Great Recession far better than their peers with a high school diploma. Today, the jobless rate for bachelor’s degree holders is less than 2 percent
Exposure to a 'class', and being an 'elective' is not gonna be terribly valuable to career decisions.
Immersion is good (Get a j-o-b in your field). A Grunt job will do.
'Dabbling' may add confusion. Get dirty.
24 hrs / day and 168 hrs / week.
HS occupies about 1/6th to 1/10th of that time.
That may be preferable, but you have to know that’s not reasonable for ALL students. Not all kids have the benefit of the access to those jobs like yours did. Not everyone knows a plumber or electrician who will let their kid “dabble” and even fewer would pay them. Some kids work to help their families financially. You’re as usual looking at your situation and conflating it into something all kids and parents can emulate. Not hardly.
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UNC4Me
...You’re as usual looking at your situation and conflating it into something all kids and parents can emulate. Not hardly.
I was with our local neighbor kids this week. (in PNW, CO and TX)
They're all doing it.
Working,
Running their own businesses.
Exploring careers (long before HS).
Several are helping their parents build new houses. (Learning to read a tape measure and 'measure twice, cut once')
They will have a great headstart on EDU, trades, career, life...
Yes, I and other parents may have been crackers to invest our lives in our kids, rather than our careers, advancement, or financial gain... But our kids really excel (on their own, in spite of their parents / educators).
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
34,690 posts, read 57,994,855 times
Reputation: 46171
Lifelong earnings of those in Skilled trades, does NOT lag lifelong earnings of 'average' College grads.
Life and earnings is very individual, but PLEASE don't consider Skilled trades as "HS ONLY educated'
Those pursuing a career in Skilled trades are not flipping burgers and selling slacks, They never have, they never will.
Apprentices in Skilled trades are making over $50k / yr from age 18, and often well over $80k by age 22. $100k is very easy with the OT a salaried 'professional(?) worker does weekly for FREE. Add 40 yrs to that number and you're talking real $$.
Agreed. This notion that college is only a path to debt and at best a McJob isn’t supported by facts. No, college isn’t for everyone, but there’s no denying that those with college degrees (when looking at median income) will out earn those without one and they’re less likely to be unemployed.
Just like going into a trade, college is what you make of it.
From the link:
The earnings gap between college graduates and those with less education continues to widen. In 2021, median income for recent graduates reached $52,000 a year for bachelor’s degree holders aged 22–27. For high school graduates the same age, median earnings are $30,000 a year.
Recent college graduates also weathered the Great Recession far better than their peers with a high school diploma. Today, the jobless rate for bachelor’s degree holders is less than 2 percent
.
This is the giant flaw in the whole college for everyone logic. They've been burning that statistic into school kids since I was in elementary school. All that changes is the numbers. The problem with that logic is twofold. First, not all jobs need a college degree. If some magic occurred and every high school graduate got a college degree, then you'd have college educated burger flippers. Second, and more importantly, not everyone has the same talents and desires. For those kids whose talents are not academic, dragging them through an "everyone must go to college" school system rather than providing vocational opportunities delays their learning those skills at best, and sets them up for academic failure at worst. School systems used to understand this and provided both college prep and vocational tracks.
I was with our local neighbor kids this week. (in PNW, CO and TX)
They're all doing it.
Working,
Running their own businesses.
Exploring careers (long before HS).
Several are helping their parents build new houses. (Learning to read a tape measure and 'measure twice, cut once')
They will have a great headstart on EDU, trades, career, life...
Yes, I and other parents may have been crackers to invest our lives in our kids, rather than our careers, advancement, or financial gain... But our kids really excel (on their own, in spite of their parents / educators).
You (or anyone) can do it too.
Choices.
They're all doing it.
Somehow I doubt that.
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(Get a j-o-b in your field). A Grunt job will do. 
