Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
1. Show me/us where the governement is saying that "a bachelor's degree...is necessary for survival". I wanna see where the government is saying that.
2. WHo are the posters -- be specific -- who deny that "anything less than college should be offered as an option".
SHOW US. Post numbers in this thread will be fine.
For some time our state has had it as a policy. Examples (note the dates are when the policies were written. It is now in redline for revision to the current policy):
The plan calls upon the department to support the work of Tennessee's districts in increasing the average ACT composite score to 21 by 2020 and in equipping the majority of high school graduates from the class of 2020 to earn a postsecondary certificate, diploma, or degree Drive to 55 Postsecondary Report pp1.
While the word certificate is included, most of the school systems, and indeed most of the language in the various reports focuses on postsecondary education = college education.
Yet, we are far from this goal. While almost 60 percent of high school graduates enroll in postsecondary, only 24 percent complete postsecondary. TNESSA State Plan Redline pp21
The majority of Tennessee’s college faculty and employers tell us that high school graduates are
not ready for the expectations they have in their classrooms and the work place. Ibid pp22
The ACT serves as a gateway to college and career in Tennessee, determining students’ eligibility
for the HOPE scholarship, requirements for postsecondary remedial or developmental coursework, and sometimes entry-level salary. Between 2011 and 2015, we have seen the average composite Tennessee ACT score for public students increase from 19.0 to 19.4. By 2020, we will raise this number to 21, signaling that the average student in Tennessee is prepared for postsecondary coursework. Ibid pp19
As a state, we have increased the college-going rate by 5 percent, which is a greater increase than the previous six years combined. In 2015, however, only 62 percent of spring graduates matriculated at postsecondary institution in the fall. In order to reach this goal, we need to prepare more students to persist in postsecondary education. Ibid pp20
Note the language used. The ACT's primary purpose is college admission. Thing is, I agree with the wording in principle; the issue I have has been the implementation. The implementation of these plans was focused on college with career training seen as a consolation prize by many educators. Now, this has changed under the current governor who is bringing back an emphasis on career and technical education, hence why the ESSA plan is under revision.
I give the plan credit for considering that earning a recognized industry certification or an appropriate ASVAB score provides evidence of education. Ready Graduate, Ibid pp80
For some time our state has had it as a policy. Examples (note the dates are when the policies were written. It is now in redline for revision to the current policy):
The plan calls upon the department to support the work of Tennessee's districts in increasing the average ACT composite score to 21 by 2020 and in equipping the majority of high school graduates from the class of 2020 to earn a postsecondary certificate, diploma, or degree Drive to 55 Postsecondary Report pp1.
While the word certificate is included, most of the school systems, and indeed most of the language in the various reports focuses on postsecondary education = college education.
Yet, we are far from this goal. While almost 60 percent of high school graduates enroll in postsecondary, only 24 percent complete postsecondary. TNESSA State Plan Redline pp21
The majority of Tennessee’s college faculty and employers tell us that high school graduates are
not ready for the expectations they have in their classrooms and the work place. Ibid pp22
The ACT serves as a gateway to college and career in Tennessee, determining students’ eligibility
for the HOPE scholarship, requirements for postsecondary remedial or developmental coursework, and sometimes entry-level salary. Between 2011 and 2015, we have seen the average composite Tennessee ACT score for public students increase from 19.0 to 19.4. By 2020, we will raise this number to 21, signaling that the average student in Tennessee is prepared for postsecondary coursework. Ibid pp19
As a state, we have increased the college-going rate by 5 percent, which is a greater increase than the previous six years combined. In 2015, however, only 62 percent of spring graduates matriculated at postsecondary institution in the fall. In order to reach this goal, we need to prepare more students to persist in postsecondary education. Ibid pp20
Note the language used. The ACT's primary purpose is college admission. Thing is, I agree with the wording in principle; the issue I have has been the implementation. The implementation of these plans was focused on college with career training seen as a consolation prize by many educators. Now, this has changed under the current governor who is bringing back an emphasis on career and technical education, hence why the ESSA plan is under revision.
I give the plan credit for considering that earning a recognized industry certification or an appropriate ASVAB score provides evidence of education. Ready Graduate, Ibid pp80
What I asked for, what I asked about...you didn't present. Period.
Right now, few schools have tech-prep curriculums. Such a curriculum would have courses such as electronics, hydraulics, mechanical operations, process monitoring and measurement, building science, small business law, technical writing, technical reading, small business economics, and multiple courses of practical algebra and plane geometry.
Most trade schools (and community colleges, for that matter) accept GED certification. Again, what is there to promote relative to such?
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
34,694 posts, read 58,012,579 times
Reputation: 46171
Quote:
Originally Posted by CorporateCowboy
The point of a high-school is education ...
one important point that is missing (pre college / job training), is career exposure.
As a society we've passed laws with the intent to protect children (a good thing), but, in fact those laws restrict employers from offering entry level positions to pre-age 18, and the threat of having a student employee that would exceed state mandated maximum work hours during School years. +/-
The LAST person to give employment / career guidance to students is somene buried within the protectionism of USA EDU employment (pig trough) (except in their field).
Really does no harm for 12+ YO to get their hands dirty and learn what it takes to earn a living. It might be incentive to stay in school Worked for the apprentices for hundreds of years. Many statesmen and leaders around the world served indentured servitude. Might reduce teen and domestic violence, crime, bullying, obesity to get them off the couch, away from the tube, and outta the house. 12+ yr olds have a lot of energy, talent, imagination, skills yet to perfect. Don't miss a teachable moment.
Probably one reasons there are no more Dairy Farm Boarding schools listed in the USA. Worked for me... 12 - 16 hrs work / day. Little time to get in trouble, but a lot of time to figure out what you DON'T want to be doing the rest of your life. Plenty of jobs can be very impressional. I thought I had 'retired' when at age 15 I escaped from the dairy farm and took a FT night shift job cleaning a pottery factory. (I had 2 other jobs on weekends + school). All of my school friends worked too. When I started at my Fortune 50 at age 17, I was cleaning 28 bathrooms (some were 8 holers). That job led me to pursue a higher calling (quickly). Directly from skilled toilet brush and waxing mops, to manufacturing, and within 6 months doing interface of NC machines to computers (in early 1970's), This was because I already knew how to do and invent stuff. That had started even before age 12. And my parents certainly had nothing to do with that!!! (except they wanted me gone, the sooner the better), I obliged.
Necessity can be the mother of inventing (yourself).
Last edited by StealthRabbit; 07-02-2023 at 10:46 PM..
The perception of working in a trade as the "greatest job in the world" varies, but fewer people choose trade careers due to societal emphasis on college education, limited awareness of trade schools, and misconceptions about these professions. Efforts are needed to promote trade schools as viable alternatives, highlighting job security, competitive wages, and entrepreneurial opportunities to encourage more people to consider trade careers.
Trade schools are either just a foot in the door or not needed at all.
In the world of trades, especially in fields paying stupid amounts of money, landing the apprenticeship is the key. Paid apprenticeship for 4-6 years, certification and/or nationally recognized union card.
Why isn't it heavily promoted? Hell, tradesmen don't even promote it. A shortage of workers keeps the pay scale up and workers in demand. Also trades tend to be tight-knit if not outright generational. Maybe roll the dice on Harvard rather than trying to break into some of them, or in some areas.
And two, the salaries stated on any google search for some trades are grossly underestimated, even lightyears wildly underestimated. I'm not even sure how they come up with them.
To me, most of those sound like community college level courses.
That's what AP courses are...just taught in high school.
But if the equivalent in vocational studies were offered in high school, there would be more kids interested in high school.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
).
Worked for the apprentices for hundreds of years. Many statesmen and leaders around the world served indentured servitude. Might reduce teen and domestic violence, crime, bullying, obesity to get them off the couch, away from the tube, and outta the house. 12+ yr olds have a lot of energy, talent, imagination, skills yet to perfect. Don't miss a teachable moment. 
(can't rep)
