Quote:
Originally Posted by Wadym
The Ukrainian People’s Republic was not a protectorate - no need to find fault with words. The UPR was an independent state recognized by both Germany and the Entente.
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You think so?
Let's see here...
"The
Ukrainian People's Republic, or
Ukrainian National Republic[a] (abbreviated to
УНР,
UNR), a predecessor of modern
Ukraine, was declared on 10 June 1917
following the February Revolution in Russia. It initially formed part of the
Russian Republic, but proclaimed its independence on 25 January 1918.
[1] During its short existence the republic went through several political transformations - from the socialist-leaning republic headed by the
Central Council with its
general secretariat to the national republic led by the
Directorate and by
Symon Petliura.
[1] Between April and December 1918 the Ukrainian People's Republic did not function, having been overthrown by the
Ukrainian State of
Pavlo Skoropadsky.
[1][2][
need quotation to verify] From late 1919 the UNR operated as
an ally of the
Second Polish Republic,
[1] but by then the state
de facto no longer existed in Ukraine.
[1] The 18 March 1921
Treaty of Riga between the Second Polish Republic,
Soviet Russia (acting also on behalf of
Soviet Belarus) and of
Soviet Ukraine sealed the fate of the Ukrainian People's Republic.
[1]
After the
Bolshevik Revolution of November 1917, many governments formed in Ukraine
[1] – most notably the Ukrainian People's Republic (based in
Kiev) and the
Ukrainian People's Republic of Soviets (1917–1918, based in
Kharkiv) and its Soviet successors. These two entities, plus the
White Movement,
Poland,
Green armies and the
Revolutionary Insurrectionary Army of Ukraine, fought constantly with each other, which resulted in many casualties among
Ukrainians fighting in a
Ukrainian War of Independence (1917-1921) as part of the wider
Russian Civil War of 1917-1922
...
Besieged by the Bolsheviks and having lost much territory, the Rada was forced to seek foreign aid, and signed the Treaty of Brest-Litovsk on 9 February 1918 to obtain military help from the German and Austro-Hungarian Empires. Germany helped the Ukrainian Army force the Bolsheviks out of Ukraine. On 20 February 1918 the council of the
Kuban People's Republic accepted the resolution for a federal union of Kuban with Ukraine as Bolshevik forces pushed towards
Yekaterinodar. It was agreed to forward the resolution for ratification to the Ukrainian government.
After the treaty of Brest-Litovsk, Ukraine became a virtual protectorate of the German Empire which at that time seemed more favorable than being overrun by the Soviet forces that were spreading
havoc in the country. Germany was anxious about losing the war and was trying to speed up the process of food extraction from Ukraine, so it decided to install its own administration in the person of
Generalfeldmarschall von Eichhorn who replaced the
Colonel General Alexander von Linsingen.On 6 April the commander of the Army group
Kijew issued an order in which he explained his intentions to execute the conditions of the treaty. That, of course, conflicted with the laws of the Ukrainian government, which annulled his order. By April 1918 the
German-
Austrian Operation Faustschlag offensive had completely removed the Bolsheviks from Ukraine.
[7][5][8][9][10] The German/Austro-Hungarian victories in Ukraine were due to the apathy of the locals and the inferior fighting skills of Bolsheviks troops compared to their Austro-Hungarian and German counterparts.
[10]"
( You can read
the rest here if interested)
So yep, so - called Ukrainian state" was a German protectorate indeed, and as you can see, a "predecessor of of modern Ukrainian state" was as much a stillborn child, as today's Ukrainian state, not being able to exist on its own.
Quote:
And what happened in Russia in yours is a separate story that has nothing to do with Ukraine.
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Nope again - since Ukraine has anything and everything to do with Russia ( they do share the common history after all,) the situation in "Russia proper" during the civil war was pretty much similar. When it comes to the same years (1918-1920) in "Russia proper," enters someone named Admiral
Alexander Kolchak, a man who "for nearly two years was Russia's internationally recognized head of state." And THAT state was prompted by Entante, as "Ukrainian state" was prompted by Germany.
And as in Ukraine the
"greens" were fighting with "whites" and "reds" ( not to mention
Makchno's anarchists,) so in "Russia proper" the "reds" were fighting with different fractions of the "whites," ( who were not necessarily all agree among themselves, thus engaging the very Ukrainian Makchno in the process.)
That's in a nutshell, so there you have it.
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No need to lie - it was the industrial and intellectual potential of Ukraine that fed Russia the past 100 years, it was the loss of this potential that forced the Russians to occupy Crimea and start war on the Donbass, where more than 18,000 russian soldiers and mercenaries from russian citizens were already killed. Exactly 100 years ago, Russia, destitute and torn apart by war, having gathered its last forces, started a war against UPR, because Ukraine was the only thing that was valuable in the Russian Empire.
The occupied part of Donbass has no value for Ukraine, but even this does not stop the Russian invaders.
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No need to invent alternative history and then to whip yourself into frenzy over it, dear patriotic Ukrainian country bumpkins.
Learn English and learn history from English-speaking sources - not recent propaganda sources, but older, academic ones, that actually cared to do a proper research.)))
You'll get the idea.
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Is it really worth the declining living standards? Yes, apparently it is to keep their neighbors from joining Europe, a war must be maintained!
