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I thought the person I quoted used some excellent logic.
Now there you go...maybe it's intentional, maybe you just don't know. But referring to God as "a being in the skies" really isn't helpful. It makes you look like a bigoted jerk. If you'd like to have a decent, cordial conversation, I'm up for it. I'm willing to overlook your insensitivity on this occasion.
Yes, homosexuality is a sinful activity, as is adultery, fornication, being a drunkard, etc..etc...
I do not condone the idea that we should harm anyone because they are sinners.
I would also point out that this nut job did the attack he did because I think he wanted to hurt America -- and not just gay people.
This has nothing to do with Christianity. The only people bringing Christianity into it are people like you, who have a bone to pick with Christianity.
Again....I have no problem sleeping at night, even though a bunch of people are mistakenly trying to lump me in with a murderous hater. This has nothing to do with me or my religion. No Christian was involved in this, and I can't recall the last time a Christian gunned down masses of people in a misguided attempt to please God.
I go there because that is my perspective. I don't see it as a God in a Heaven, I see it as a mythical being in the sky. If the sterility of it makes you angry I can't do anything about that. Do you see the act of non-belief as bigoted? Jerkish? Insensitive? That I do not believe as you do makes me mean? This is similar to how the gay community feels about you.
To you, homosexuality is a sinful activity, not to me. Of course, you do not wish harm on anyone, never implied that. But, you do share the sentiment about gay people as illustrated in your post. You will be associated not as harmful but as a brother in belief. Just as I would take the brunt of my families actions, Christians will as well. It's not accurate, it's emotional. That was the point.
Christianity and Muslims share the same sentiment about homosexuals. I didn't bring you into it, your beliefs do. That is why people are linking the two. Your common thread is the belief that homosexuality is a sin. Nobody said all would agree to it being punished in America by death. But, you do both agree that it is punishable by your gods. That is your link, it's not made by me but by you.
I only suggested that you handle it well. You represent your belief. I ask for your understanding at this time and that you realize it will cool off with distance. I didn't mean to upset you. I do understand you feel attacked at the moment but, everyone, not only Christians are capable of anger, sadness, and useless blame. I only asked you to take it for the sake of association and to understand it after such a tragedy. The choice is ultimately yours, though, of course.
I go there because that is my perspective. I don't see it as a God in a Heaven, I see it as a mythical being in the sky. If the sterility of it makes you angry I can't do anything about that. Do you see the act of non-belief as bigoted? Jerkish? Insensitive? That I do not believe as you do makes me mean?
Since we are talking about the views of Christians, then "how you see it" really isn't relevant, is it? When you use that kind of language to describe our religion, you misstate what we believe and it just makes you look mean-spirited. Just an fyi. If you want us to take you seriously, please realize you should strive to show some attempt at respect.
Quote:
To you, homosexuality is a sinful activity, not to me. Of course, you do not wish harm on anyone, never implied that. But, you do share the sentiment about gay people as illustrated in your post. You will be associated not as harmful but as a brother in belief. Just as I would take the brunt of my families actions, Christians will as well. It's not accurate, it's emotional. That was the point.
To our God it's a sinful activity. But to associate us with evil murderous people is not constructive.
Quote:
Christianity and Muslims share the same sentiment about homosexuals. I didn't bring you into it, your beliefs do. That is why people are linking the two. Your common thread is the belief that homosexuality is a sin. Nobody said all would agree to it being punished in America by death. But, you do both agree that it is punishable by your gods. That is your link, it's not made by me but by you.
So the next time I hear of a bank robbery I should go after all the Bernie Sanders supporters because they share a negative view of bankers? That would be a viable comparison.
Quote:
I only suggested that you handle it well. You represent your belief. I ask for your understanding at this time and that you realize it will cool off with distance. I didn't mean to upset you. I do understand you feel attacked at the moment but, everyone, not only Christians are capable of anger, sadness, and useless blame. I only asked you to take it for the sake of association and to understand it after such a tragedy. The choice is ultimately yours, though, of course.
I would suggest that not even inserting us into the conversation would be the best route to take. Again--it isn't Christians going around and killing people.
Since we are talking about the views of Christians, then "how you see it" really isn't relevant, is it? When you use that kind of language to describe our religion, you misstate what we believe and it just makes you look mean-spirited. Just an fyi. If you want us to take you seriously, please realize you should strive to show some attempt at respect. It's nice to see you share the same sentiment as the gay community. Of course, I will respect your belief by talking about God in the first person when I address you. No problem.
To our God it's a sinful activity. But to associate us with evil murderous people is not constructive. I'll say this one more time, your beliefs that homosexuality is punishable by God is your association. It's not by people from the outside. That is your cross to bear, not mine.
So the next time I hear of a bank robbery I should go after all the Bernie Sanders supporters because they share a negative view of bankers? That would be a viable comparison. Indeed, if their beliefs were that that was a punishable offense and you shared those. I doubt you'd feel very connected to them if a few of them started killing bankers. It would probably taint your view. That's natural, it's human to respond that way. This tragedy has tainted people's view of people who feel being gay is punishable by God.
I would suggest that not even inserting us into the conversation would be the best route to take. Again--it isn't Christians going around and killing people.
You've inserted yourself. Look at the media, they've shown Chick Filet serving people in the gay community to show despite their ties to belief, they will not share them with this killer. That's just what Christians will have to do to deny association for awhile. You were asked how you felt, you should just state as a Christian how you honestly feel. Defending yourself after pages and pages on gay condemnation will get you nowhere. Try to understand that. Be the bigger person and put your money where your mouth is.
Christianity will be linked by the idea that gays are punished by God. There is nothing you can do about it but to make it clear you will stop discriminating against gays. That you will not condone violence. That's the only choice for Christians is this situation. I know it's uncomfortable but those tables have turned. Handle it with grace. People who don't share your belief are afraid of your beliefs now. Try and be understanding and reassuring. That's all. Defensive behavior just ruins your message.
(Not yelling with caps, just distinguishing posts)
Last edited by PoppySead; 06-15-2016 at 01:39 PM..
People will be hurt and angry at Christians and Muslims right now. It's your job as a leader in your community to put people at ease and I'm glad for the most part I'm seeing you do this. There's really no room to get "jiggy" with it.
The only ones angry at Christians are those who hate Christians in general and many of them are right here on this thread. They have vented their anger in the past and now it is spilling over. This is the only place where I have seen so much hatred towards Christians in this country.
And you don't seem to understand the mindset that it is still sin, and we are not going to embrace sin just because society does. You wouldn't expect a church to allow a couple to bring beer and drugs to date night either, would you?
You fail to understand that sin (the act of violating god's will) is a religious concept that has no place in the real world.... What has not been considered sin in the bible includes genocide, human slavery, stoning non-virgin brides to death forcing some rape victims to marry their rapists, executing other rape victims; treating wives as property, putting people who work on the sabbath and disobedient children to death, etc. The list goes on and on.....Do you consider homosexuality, which harms nobody a worse crime than the examples I listed above?
Quote:
"But now I am writing to you that you must not associate with anyone who claims to be a brother or sister but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or slanderer, a drunkard or swindler. Do not even eat with such people."
1 Corinthians 5:11
Exodus...(God's laws) Try reading all of it...
21:15 And he that smiteth his father, or his mother, shall be surely put to death.
21:17 And he that curseth his father, or his mother, shall surely be put to death.
The only ones angry at Christians are those who hate Christians in general and many of them are right here on this thread. They have vented their anger in the past and now it is spilling over. This is the only place where I have seen so much hatred towards Christians in this country.
I'm sorry you feel that way. I believe some Muslims share your sentiment. You feel unfairly judged by others. Like I told Vizio, not only gays but everyone takes a turn on this seat. It will pass. We are all guilty at some point. I understand.
The only ones angry at Christians are those who hate Christians in general and many of them are right here on this thread. They have vented their anger in the past and now it is spilling over. This is the only place where I have seen so much hatred towards Christians in this country.
I notice that while you like to continue to complain about the perceived mistreatment of Christians , you don't seem to have it in you to address things like what I bring up in post 387.
The reason Christians are mentioned here in an event perpetrated by a Muslim is that people see the same strain of hatred towards gays as the Muslims show . If you doubt this and think people are being unfair to Christians all you need to do is read the comments from Christians about how gays need to be killed, or put behind electric fences , or have the gay beat out of them , or read the Christian pastors celebrating the deaths of these gay people in FL . The fact that they are likely not the majority view of Christianity does not alter the fact that these views are showing up in regular churches and doesn't seem to be confined to some fringe groups like Westboro anymore .
Do you think gays have no reason to be concerned when people who identify as Christian are publicly approving of the mass killings of gays ?
This is not an attack post , I'm truly interested whether you see and understand the hatred that is showing up in non fringe Christianity and can see the comments from the point of view of a group of people whose deaths are either being celebrated as a good thing or at least being dismissed as nothing worth worrying about, much like a pack of dogs or feral cats being killed off .
Yes, this is understandable. Fear would, of course, trump faith in people who condemn homosexuality and promise punishment by God at this moment.
This shooting has put a new perspective on the ill feelings toward the gay community. People see how it can impact them, people see they are human beings who deserve respect. Hopefully, Muslims and Christians can both experience how it feels to be judged unfairly because of fear and anger briefly enough to put an end to it once and for all. Let us all live together peacefully.
Maybe some good can come out of this horrible event.
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