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Old 09-13-2012, 01:36 PM
 
Location: Shaw.
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Has anyone looked into self-identity? As you go east, at what point do people stop saying they're living in the Midwest (I know people from Pittsburgh don't tend to view themselves as Midwest, but I've heard mixed things about Buffalo). Same question for going west. I'm sure the Rocky Mountains have a lot to do with the dividing line.
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Old 09-13-2012, 04:31 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garmin239 View Post
False. but This isn't about small towns anyways. It's about the metro areas.



That is 100% false. Look at the link I posted for the Italian demographics. Rochester has around the same and in some cases higher Italian population than cities more East. This is also true for many cities when regarding Puerto Ricans.

I don't see what Puerto Ricans or Italians have much to do with prevailing cultural attitudes. From living in 3 subregions of the USA (west, midwest, and south) and having visited the east coast plenty of times (NYC,DC,Boston) I just can't wrap my head around including places like Rochester or Buffalo in with the east coast but can easily with the great lakes/rust belt portion of the midwest. Again, all that happens to Italians and Puerto Ricans who live in the midwest is that they become more midwestern.

I'm half Puerto Rican btw.
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Old 09-13-2012, 05:58 PM
 
Location: Nesconset, NY
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Quote:
Originally Posted by callmemaybe View Post
What is a common thread that makes Bismarck, North Dakota and Akron, Ohio both Midwestern? Would you say it's the farming/blue collar roots of the places? The relatively level terrain? The average personality traits?
Their distance from an ocean?
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Old 09-13-2012, 08:16 PM
 
3,234 posts, read 7,639,816 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PosterExtraordinaire View Post
I don't see what Puerto Ricans or Italians have much to do with prevailing cultural attitudes. From living in 3 subregions of the USA (west, midwest, and south) and having visited the east coast plenty of times (NYC,DC,Boston) I just can't wrap my head around including places like Rochester or Buffalo in with the east coast but can easily with the great lakes/rust belt portion of the midwest. Again, all that happens to Italians and Puerto Ricans who live in the midwest is that they become more midwestern.

I'm half Puerto Rican btw.
There is your problem. You don't seem to recognize that there is a difference between east coast and interior northeast. There is the interior northeast that is not the same as the coast and has little in common with the midwest. And if you have that attitude in the first place, why question the demographics for so many posts? Seems a bit odd. You have not spent much time in the interior northeast and it shows with your postings.
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Old 09-13-2012, 08:53 PM
 
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Originally Posted by garmin239 View Post
There is your problem. You don't seem to recognize that there is a difference between east coast and interior northeast. There is the interior northeast that is not the same as the coast and has little in common with the midwest. And if you have that attitude in the first place, why question the demographics for so many posts? Seems a bit odd. You have not spent much time in the interior northeast and it shows with your postings.
All of America has plenty of similarities. I never felt alien in any place I moved to. They are all very similar and people here entirely exaggerate the differences.

If you want to make up a category for "interior northeast" go ahead. We can make a billion categories. Someone from Detroit can say he shares next to nothing with someone from Akron, and especially Minneapolis and he'd be as right as you're being. But using large, aggregate categories, Buffalo and Rochester belong more in the midwest than the east coast.

And there are parts of the east coast that are "interior" like Vermont and New Hampshire and Maine. Those don't feel midwestern to me at all. But Buffalo does, and the reasons are deeper than how they talk.
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Old 09-13-2012, 09:48 PM
 
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Originally Posted by PosterExtraordinaire View Post
All of America has plenty of similarities. I never felt alien in any place I moved to. They are all very similar and people here entirely exaggerate the differences.

If you want to make up a category for "interior northeast" go ahead. We can make a billion categories. Someone from Detroit can say he shares next to nothing with someone from Akron, and especially Minneapolis and he'd be as right as you're being. But using large, aggregate categories, Buffalo and Rochester belong more in the midwest than the east coast.

And there are parts of the east coast that are "interior" like Vermont and New Hampshire and Maine. Those don't feel midwestern to me at all. But Buffalo does, and the reasons are deeper than how they talk.
and besides a somewhat similar accent you have failed to show how the NY cities are similar to the midwest. You questioned things like demographics and I have shown how you were wrong in your assertions. I am not making up anything. The coastal parts of the northeast are different from the interior parts in ways which are different from the midwest. You lack knowledge of the northeastern United States and that's OK. it's an area you are not familiar with.
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Old 09-13-2012, 09:50 PM
 
2,076 posts, read 3,083,919 times
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Originally Posted by garmin239 View Post
and besides a somewhat similar accent you have failed to show how the NY cities are similar to the midwest. You questioned things like demographics and I have shown how you were wrong in your assertions. I am not making up anything. The coastal parts of the northeast are different from the interior parts in ways which are different from the midwest. You lack knowledge of the northeastern United States and that's OK. it's an area you are not familiar with.
You haven't done that. I pointed out Italians/Puerto Ricans go down a gradient from their point of entry (NYC). It's all irrelevant though. American Italians are american italians. Same for Puerto Ricans. More things they have in common are topography, climate, and economy.
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Old 09-13-2012, 10:01 PM
 
3,234 posts, read 7,639,816 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PosterExtraordinaire View Post
You haven't done that. I pointed out Italians/Puerto Ricans go down a gradient from their point of entry (NYC). It's all irrelevant though. American Italians are american italians. Same for Puerto Ricans. More things they have in common are topography, climate, and economy.
You thought you pointed out that they go down a gradient from their point of entry but were dead wrong. Seems weird that all of the sudden you bring up things like climate, economy and topography after the fact that your other argument fell apart. If you want to bring up those things, then there is a whole other world of argument seeing that those things are either not similar between the NY and midestern cities... or not geographically relevant as they spread over several regions. Rust belt is not a midwestern issue. It spans several regions. Climate is also shared between several regions and topography differs.
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Old 09-13-2012, 10:07 PM
 
Location: Minneapolis
2,331 posts, read 3,061,889 times
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I think the idea of the interior northeast exists to most of the people who have lived in it. When I was growing up in upstate New York (Utica) I considered my self an easterner but not an east coaster, we were the other northeast. Having lived in the Midwest for much of my life (Minneapolis and Chicago) I would never consider the interior northeast to be part of the Midwest but I think it is reasonable to make the case that northeastern Ohio is acutally part of the interior northeast or is a transition zone between it and the Midwest.
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Old 09-13-2012, 10:36 PM
 
2,076 posts, read 3,083,919 times
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Originally Posted by garmin239 View Post
You thought you pointed out that they go down a gradient from their point of entry but were dead wrong. Seems weird that all of the sudden you bring up things like climate, economy and topography after the fact that your other argument fell apart. If you want to bring up those things, then there is a whole other world of argument seeing that those things are either not similar between the NY and midestern cities... or not geographically relevant as they spread over several regions. Rust belt is not a midwestern issue. It spans several regions. Climate is also shared between several regions and topography differs.
Your demographics argument was always a red herring and I showed you it wrong with Cleveland which is more Puerto Rican than Buffalo and by raw numbers, Rochester. But it has and always is irrelevant to the culture. You guys speak the same? Imagine why? Because there is a greater interchange between you and other great lakes cities than east coast ones.
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