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But you see, what makes so many people angry is that so very many Christians use the bible to try to control OTHERS behavior.....not their own. People who are angry at having the church crammed down their throats don't understand that He knows we're going to make mistakes and bad choices...knows it before it happens...and already knows He's going to forgive them/us if we are truly sorry for what we did.
Some people don't want to be held accountable for their behaviors... it's been that way since the beginning of time. Don't worry so much about it. When we get angry and start saying and doing hurtful things, what kind of an example is that of true "Christianity"? You have Him in your life. He understands your frustrations. Perhaps situations and discussions like these are a true test of what's inside you/me/us. Have you heard that saying..... '"You never know what's inside a vessel until it gets bumped or knocked around a bit. Be careful of what you allow to ferment inside of your heart. Even the most perfect of grapes, which were destined to be fine wine...can turn to vinegar."'
As iron sharpens iron so does one man sharpen another. As Christians it is our duty to be the light of the world. To set the standard of what is write and what is wrong according to God. Yet Jesus warns that we must always look at ourselves before criticizing others. At the same time when there are laws being past that affect both you and me and go against what God has stated in the Bible Christians are not to just stand there and say nothing. They are to proclaim what is true according to the Bible
Even when it is 100 against 1... a sincere Christian will hold their ground.
Well, we all get our guidelines from the same place. But, as you say, everyone likes to make up their own - own 'take' anyway, to fit their own desires. Christians too. They even interpret the Bible to suit themselves. I would not be so arrogant as to use the term 'evil' though. I leave that to the 'Holier-than-thou' brigade.
So the source is the most useful, without the various takes. The source? Our brains.
1) You need to stop using Christian examples to create the case that Christianity is a false religion. Yes the Bible has a set of guidelines. But people are flawed... EVEN CHRISTIANS. I have not met very few Christians that even come close to following the Bible 100% Being a Christian is a process. If you are going to attack... attack the Bible... the original source AND not what you have seen "Christians" have done in the past.
2) The Bible tells us not to lean on our own understanding, because it is flawed. God's understanding is perfect and pure. The more we lean on His understanding the more we prosper (and not money-making way).
Noah leaned on God's understanding and everyone else used their own understanding. Then it started to rain...
As iron sharpens iron so does one man sharpen another. As Christians it is our duty to be the light of the world. To set the standard of what is write and what is wrong according to God. Yet Jesus warns that we must always look at ourselves before criticizing others. At the same time when there are laws being past that affect both you and me and go against what God has stated in the Bible Christians are not to just stand there and say nothing. They are to proclaim what is true according to the Bible
Even when it is 100 against 1... a sincere Christian will hold their ground.
-Lot
-Noah
-Paul
See, that is the problem with you cretins. You assume that you live in a theocracy but ignore the fact it is a democracy meaning the will of the majority rules.
If you are so sure the USA public will support your fundamental approach, start a united christian party and see how far you get or who will support you.
Xianity is NOT conservative, it is subversive, particularly the American evangelicals.
Do you believe the Bible was inspired by God? Yes or no?
"Inspired by" Yes....... "Written by".....NO! The bible was written by imperfect human beings who felt "inspired by God" to write those things. IMHO....and listen, I am speaking as someone who spent over 1/2 my life in church....20 of those years as a worship leader/pianist.... and I disagreed with 2/3 of the opinions shared there. I not only was involved with my own church, but several different denominations in the community as well. They all have their own views on things....preach from a passage in the bible and expanding on it from their own viewpoints. I deal with Him on a person level and I NEVER allow someone to tell me what God wants for my life OR what THEY think He wants me to do. I do not need for someone else to tell me those things.....as He is perfectly capable of telling me those things directly.
Here's just a little tidbit that you and others might find silly....but I'm gonna share it anyway.
I "belonged" to a church while living "down south" as a young adult. In the middle of a horrendous snow/ice storm, on a Sunday morning, I was getting ready for church. I felt as if wearing slacks and a sweater would be a good and intelligent idea....and in fact, felt like the Lord would totally approve of such a wise action....after all, a woman in long pants and a long-sleeved sweater was certainly more covered up than a woman wearing a dress above her knees and high-heeled shoes. Well, my husband notified me that my attire was totally unacceptable....that WOMEN did NOT wear pants to church.....COULD not wear pants to church! I let him know that I failed to see how that made any sense whatsoever.....that IF Jesus were to return for his children, IMHO....and he was scanning the congregation to see who was comin' home with Him.....He most CERTAINLY was not going to say.....'"Well, I was gonna take you too, but you're wearing PANTS to church....and that is TOTALLY unacceptable."' I felt as if Jesus would be proud of me....for not buying into the ridiculous concept of what or what NOT I should be wearing to church.....especially in such horrid weather!
Okay.....long story short, I did NOT go to church that day and furthermore, spoke to a couple of the elders of 2 different churches in the community about the issue of pants vs skirts/dresses. I received the same information.. '"It is completely inappropriate for women to wear pants to church...it is simply NOT done"" Needless to say......I didn't attend church for 4 years....and NEVER again in the south. When I finally did begin attending church again, it was in a church which ascribed to the "Come just as you are" policy. That's what I believe He wants from us.... to come just as you are....not because someone's threatening you with hell fire and damnation. You wanna shove people away from Christ? All you have to do is threaten, bully, criticize and judge them. Are you with Him, or against Him? He wants us to LOVE people...to open our arms and accept people, just the way they are. Do we have to agree with everything they do? No! He doesn't ask us to do that.....ever. But then, that's MY interpretation....that's what I hear Him saying to ME.
As iron sharpens iron so does one man sharpen another. As Christians it is our duty to be the light of the world. To set the standard of what is write and what is wrong according to God. Yet Jesus warns that we must always look at ourselves before criticizing others. At the same time when there are laws being past that affect both you and me and go against what God has stated in the Bible Christians are not to just stand there and say nothing. They are to proclaim what is true according to the Bible
Even when it is 100 against 1... a sincere Christian will hold their ground.
-Lot
-Noah
-Paul
Yes, we need to be there to "vote" against "laws" which go against what we believe is right, just as those who disagree will vote their own conscience as well. Trust that good will prevail. He is still in charge. We do need to be careful with that "iron sharpens iron" theory though......We need to be careful to only sharpen each other.... because far too often that iron is used as a sword to cut those who do not believe as we do. Rub gently my friend and be cautious how you hold your blade. How you hold your blade to the sharpening stone can either sharpen or further wear down the edge we already have.
Just as I appear as a brick wall... so you do you to ME.
But Paul, who wrote most of the new testament, was one of the biggest anti-christian people on the block. He hated Christians. He definitely appeared as a "wall." Then his life was changed and he became one of the strongest Christians the world has seen. Walls can be torn down : )
What if I am wrong? I still win because I lived a moral life that has not hindered my health : )
how do you know i'm not living a moral life?
I never intentionally hurt anyone, I don't sleep around, I don't lie, I do an honest job in my work.... but just because I don't believe in your fairy tale I'm not living a moral life?
and some Jews believe that Jesus lived 130 years before the christians claimed he did (new fact!) -->>"Some argue that there is no relationship between Yeshu and the historical Jesus; some argue that Yeshu refers to the historical Jesus; some argue that Yeshu is a literary device used by Rabbis to comment on their relationship to and with early Christians. Some rabbis[SIZE=3][41][/SIZE] understood these references as referring to Jesus and based on them believed that Jesus lived 130 years prior to the date that Christians believe he lived, contradicting the Gospels' account regarding the chronology of Jesus." http://judaism.about.com/gi/dynamic/..._view_of_Jesus
and besides some people just don't want or need religion:
A person may only believe in one god, not 2 or 3: not polytheistic!
It could be Christianity was invented to appease the monotheists with polytheistic yearnings!
*thumbs up!*
Kate
Last edited by sarahkate_m; 09-16-2009 at 10:38 AM..
Reason: link happy
Just as I appear as a brick wall... so you do you to ME.
But Paul, who wrote most of the new testament, was one of the biggest anti-christian people on the block. He hated Christians. He definitely appeared as a "wall." Then his life was changed and he became one of the strongest Christians the world has seen. Walls can be torn down : )
What if I am wrong? I still win because I lived a moral life that has not hindered my health : )
Good point. Paul once converted just to get laid. The fact he wrote the bulk of the bible should tell you something.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SouperStar34
Non-Christian's motto: "What's in it for me?"
-Money
-Power
-Fame
This is a very wordly/selfish mind-set.
Absolutely agree, your highest clergy should be ashamed of themselves for indulging in those mind-sets.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SouperStar34
He desires a true and sincere love. He did not create us as robots to automatically follow him, but rather he gave people the choice to follow Him. This choice allows a sincere bond between Him and mankind.
Worship me or be cast into hellfire for eternity. Some choice.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SouperStar34
The God of the Bible always was and always will be.
What you really mean is that this is your motto. What you're essentially saying is that you're wicked and immoral and have absolutely no self control so you need religion to make you be moral. The vast majority of atheists are moral and decent people. The difference is that they don't need the belief in some tyrannical spaceman in order to be moral.
As iron sharpens iron so does one man sharpen another. As Christians it is our duty to be the light of the world. To set the standard of what is write and what is wrong according to God. Yet Jesus warns that we must always look at ourselves before criticizing others. At the same time when there are laws being past that affect both you and me and go against what God has stated in the Bible Christians are not to just stand there and say nothing. They are to proclaim what is true according to the Bible
Even when it is 100 against 1... a sincere Christian will hold their ground.
-Lot
-Noah
-Paul
Feel more than free to site examples of any and all laws impinging on YOUR right to worship as you see fit.
There is NO inherent right in this, or any Nation, for you to impose YOUR religion onto everyone else through Laws.
Shall I wait up for this list of laws impinging on your right to worship?
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