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Old 11-20-2017, 04:51 AM
 
Location: Russia
2,216 posts, read 1,022,468 times
Reputation: 946

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Quote:
Originally Posted by snj90 View Post
You know, I actually feel bad for Russian soldiers killed in Ukraine. Their deaths, and their families' grief, are "fake news" to Russians. Ukrainian soldiers who have been killed are remembered as heroes.
There are no Russian soldiers in the fact of the matter is, if they was really there, there would be peace and quiet. And here they are fighting with the Russian army in Crimea and what is not fighting a single shot.And you know why? Because there are Russian soldiers and Russia is not at war with Ukraine. People Yes, terribly sorry for,the civil war,is just scary.
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Old 11-20-2017, 06:10 AM
 
Location: Russia
5,786 posts, read 4,234,324 times
Reputation: 1742
Quote:
Originally Posted by snj90 View Post
You know, I actually feel bad for Russian soldiers killed in Ukraine. Their deaths, and their families' grief, are "fake news" to Russians. Ukrainian soldiers who have been killed are remembered as heroes.
They are not soldiers. They are volunteers. This is a different legal status.
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Old 11-20-2017, 09:01 AM
 
9,511 posts, read 5,443,411 times
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Most of the Russian volunteers that came to fight were older men age 40 plus along with some younger adrenalin junkies and mercenaries sponsored by various Russian Oligarchs and governments such as the Chechens. No doubt even some Russian soldiers on "vacation" too and looking for a chance to put their skills and themselves to the test not to discount the fact that it seems Russian males like a good fight once in awhile.

The sad thing is at the end of the day Tyruchinov, who was acting president when this all started is still breathing. None of this had to happen. Period.
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Old 11-20-2017, 10:06 AM
 
26,787 posts, read 22,549,184 times
Reputation: 10038
Quote:
Originally Posted by snj90 View Post
You know, I actually feel bad for Russian soldiers killed in Ukraine. Their deaths, and their families' grief, are "fake news" to Russians. Ukrainian soldiers who have been killed are remembered as heroes.
They are remembered as thugs that kill civilians first of all.
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Old 11-20-2017, 11:17 AM
 
Location: Finland
24,128 posts, read 24,808,159 times
Reputation: 11103
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
Ariete do something please.

He is obsessed with Finno-Mongols)))
Argh, I didn't want to get into it. Ok, but here goes.

While it is true that Baltic Finnic peoples were the majority in some parts of present-day Russia, the area is by linguistic place name evidence mostly limited northwest of roughly the line Lake Peipus-Lake Ilmen-Lake Onega and the Archangelsk area (Bjarmaland). Vepsians and Chudes have been probably quite significant as they were co-founders of Rurik's Rus', but as living so close to Novgorod, the assimilation has started very early.

While still around 1000 AD you could technically travel from Finland to the river Volga by speaking only Uralic languages yourself, the reality is much more complex. Volga Uralic speakers (Komi, Mari, Mordvin etc) are both linguistically and genetically so distant from Finnic speakers, that it's seems impossible that there has been any language continuum encompassing the whole area from the Gulf of Finland to the Volga - or even regular contact. Finns are already a genetic isolate, and modern Volga Uralic -speakers genetically much closer to Eastern Slavs than Baltic Finns. As these languages are alive and well today, they have/are/until recently been the majority in the areas they live now, but these aren't very big land areas.

There were Uralic speakers of now extinct languages like Merya and Muromian between these earlier mentioned areas. They were previously though of being of some kind of intermittent relatives with a language half Finnic - half Volga Uralic, but this theory has later been abandoned. Early Russian chronicles refer to these people as small princes and merchant-farmers, so one can assume that they were the majority only in small areas, or more of a minority class. Also Komi, Mari and Permian-speakers were more associated with peoples like Volga Bulgars and Tatars opposed to any people living in the west of them.

Thus while Uralic languages were 1000 years ago much more widespread than now, it is hugely unlikely that the numbers have been very large, or they being the majority of much of the Northern half of modern European side of Russia. What is likely that an assimilation has started very early, and very likely the people have been multilingual due to living in a melting pot in this Vologda-Yaroslavl-Nishny Novgorod region.

Last edited by Ariete; 11-20-2017 at 11:34 AM..
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Old 11-20-2017, 11:24 AM
DKM
 
Location: California
6,767 posts, read 3,858,538 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
They are remembered as thugs that kill civilians first of all.
Bravo! I never imagined you would accurately describe Russian soldiers in Ukraine.
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Old 11-20-2017, 11:48 AM
 
Location: Russia
2,216 posts, read 1,022,468 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DKM View Post
Bravo! I never imagined you would accurately describe Russian soldiers in Ukraine.
No, it is about these "heroes".
https://youtu.be/wdr94ih2NXk
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Old 11-20-2017, 12:29 PM
 
3,216 posts, read 2,386,009 times
Reputation: 1387
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariete View Post
While still around 1000 AD you could technically travel from Finland to the river Volga by speaking only Uralic languages yourself, the reality is much more complex. Volga Uralic speakers (Komi, Mari, Mordvin etc) are both linguistically and genetically so distant from Finnic speakers, that it's seems impossible that there has been any language continuum encompassing the whole area from the Gulf of Finland to the Volga - or even regular contact. Finns are already a genetic isolate, and modern Volga Uralic -speakers genetically much closer to Eastern Slavs than Baltic Finns.
Finns are a genetic isolate indeed but Finns are still in some respects close to Volga Uralic speakers such as Mari, Udmurt and Komi.
Here are European Y--dna haplogrups given by country (separate ethnicities such as Tatars, Mordvin, Mari who live in Russia and others are shown separately).
https://www.eupedia.com/europe/europ...logroups.shtml

I handpicked speakers of East Slavic (Russia, Belarus, Ukraine), Baltic Finnish (Finland, Estonia) and Volga Uralic (Mari, Komi, Udmurt, Mordvin). R1a is a "Balto-Slavic" haplogrup, N is "Uralic". You can see Finns are still close to Volga Uralic speakers such as Mari, Udmurt and Komi as they have a lot that N haplogroup, Finns have almost same amount as Maris have. In turn Volga Uralics have more that R1a.
Besides, you can also see that Russians are still Slavic, not Finno-Ugric, don't you think?

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Old 11-20-2017, 12:53 PM
 
Location: Finland
24,128 posts, read 24,808,159 times
Reputation: 11103
Having a certain haplogroup still doesn't mean much, but you have to dig deeper and analyze much more data.
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Old 11-20-2017, 12:59 PM
 
Location: Russia
2,216 posts, read 1,022,468 times
Reputation: 946
Hmm,all this talk reminds me of conversations about racial correctness that took place in Europe in the early 20th century. No offense, just very surprising to read this.
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