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The worrying thing is that all this ridiculous nonsense go through Russians like a hot knife through butter, when to westerners all these stupid stories are completely uninmaginable.
They are "completely unimaginable to westerners" because westerners don't undergo the "ethnic cleansing" all that often. Now do they?
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Would all these things with murdering civilians, resettling population, concentration camps etc be things YOU would do if you would conquer us?
What it has got to do with ME? Did I ever say that I was god almighty himself?
When we said that a military coup - it's bad and it does not need to support, everyone laughed at us. And now there is a civil war.
You can continue to laugh further.
Tell me more about "filtration camps" please - I've heard a lot that they are planned for East Ukrainians. From what I understand the plan is to "check them on loyalty" to the new government and then to resettle them to different parts of Ukraine, while resettling the West Ukrainians to the Eastern part of the country.
Is it true?
Do you know who is behind this plan if it's true?
These camps already exist and those refugees who decided to go to Ukraine, first put there for check, if they related to militia, they go under arrest. I asked my friend from "Oplot" to tell me more, he told that there are few such camps already built, but Ukraine has no money, so they don't have a reason to keep building and few cities will be turned into ghettos where people will live before deportation to another parts of Ukraine. I suppose he meant Slavyansk, Kramatorsk and another small cities of Donbass. In the same time participants of ATO will receive as compensation land here after deportation of russian people to another parts of Ukraine
They are "completely unimaginable to westerners" because westerners don't undergo the "ethnic cleansing" all that often. Now do they?
What it has got to do with ME? Did I ever say that I was god almighty himself?
It has, and there's a 100% consensus that it will never happen again if you even remotely want to be "a part of Europe". If Ukraine want's that, (as Kiev do want), they can do nothing of the sort, otherwise Ukraine would be a new North Korea nobody wants anything to do with.
Not especially targeted towards you, but much of the propaganda that people in this thread sincerely believe in is shocking. For us all this ethnic cleansing stuff is as uninmaginable as Queen Elizabeth II eating babies for breakfast. It just can't and will not happen.
These camps already exist and those refugees who decided to go to Ukraine, first put there for check, if they related to militia, they go under arrest. I asked my friend from "Oplot" to tell me more, he told that there are few such camps already built, but Ukraine has no money, so they don't have a reason to keep building and few cities will be turned into ghettos where people will live before deportation to another parts of Ukraine. I suppose he meant Slavyansk, Kramatorsk and another small cities of Donbass. In the same time participants of ATO will receive as compensation land here after deportation of russian people to another parts of Ukraine
The only "camps" I know about where civilian refugees from eastern Ukraine have been temporarily sheltered are children's summer camps, which have been hastily refurbished to accommodate women, children, and the elderly. Many churches and charitable organizations have assisted, and local citizens are bringing in food, clothing, and other needed supplies. See jeremiahshope.org for more information about just such an organization assisting civilian refugees from Slavyansk. All of these refugees chose to leave Slavyansk to protect themselves and their children from the violence and totalitarian regime attempting to establish itself in place of the rightful, democratic government of Ukraine. I hope and expect most of the refugees will return, now that Slavyansk has been liberated and stability and legal government are being restored.
Also, as of today, water and electricity are being repaired in Slavyansk by the order of the elected Ukrainian government, and food - bread and stew - is being given free of charge to the residents, who have been suffering under the control of "Donbass" for the last three months.
Don't be so quick to swallow all the negative propaganda which is coming from Russia. Are you aware that the Kremlin is paying people to post pro-Russian, anti-Ukrainian (and often anti-American) falsehoods and major distortions of fact in the comments section of many prominent Western news sources, including "The Washington Post", "The Wall Street Journal". CNN, ABC, "The New York Times", and many others? Their efforts are very obvious, given frequent misspellings, misuse of words and colloquial American English phrases, non-native English speaking grammatical mistakes, and of course, their obvious slant and deliberate disinformation.
Such comments are very much like the black and white pictures a "Novorossiya" supporter has recently posted in this thread, claiming that they are current pictures from the conflict at Slavyansk. Instead, they appear to date to World War II - they are certainly not contemporary, as can be easily determined by the uniforms of the soldiers, particularly their helmets. How dumb do posters like this think the rest of us are??
So - read as many different news sources as possible, Western as well as Russian and Ukrainian. Have an open mind. Read the comments from the various leaders, then research what they're talking about for yourself, looking for all points of view.
All these claims of the Kyiv government being fascist are hogwash. Yes, there are right-wing parties in Ukraine - just as there are democratic parties, leftist parties, probably libertarian parties, green parties, progressive parties, conservative parties, and certainly moderate, middle-of-the-road parties, which draw the greatest number of supporters.
This is a trait of a healthy democracy, where all are allowed freedom to think for themselves and draw their own conclusions about the best way to govern. The existence of such parties doesn't mean that the elected party in power necessarily holds or endorses the same views - just that the overall government allows its citizens the freedom to believe as they think best, and to support those who hold the same views. You won't find this sort of freedom in Russia at present, sadly...and it's very sad that many in eastern Ukraine were fed a diet of Russian propaganda and were victimized by fear tactics based on lies.
It's clear from the comments of many civilian residents of eastern Ukraine that their support of "Donbass" is fear-based, and that they have no accurate knowledge of the Kyiv government's intentions. This was caused by Russia's - actually Putin's - efforts to lure eastern Ukraine back into the Russian sphere of influence, perhaps with the notion of recreating the old Soviet Union once again, despite the best interests of the citizens of the various regions and countries which were once part of the USSR, but which have been independent since the dismembering of the USSR. Rather than doing this honestly and forthrightly, so that the countries of the former Soviet Union might perhaps join Russia not politically, but for economic, cultural, trade, educational, health, and environmental reasons, Putin chose to lie, to spread fear, to foster violence and terrorism, all for his own ambitions.
Wretched little narcissistic man...
So - turn off the Russian channels, read and watch as many different news sources online as you can, if you can't tune in the Kyiv-based TV stations, listen to western radio broadcasts, and try to get a broader perspective of what is happening in your beautiful, long-suffering country. Things can get better - much better - but it won't happen under Putin's influence, nor with a tiny "Novorussiya" and non-Ukrainian, Russian-funded terrorists coming into Ukraine over the Russian border. It CAN and will happen in a united, democratic, free and independent Ukraine.
So learn the facts, be willing to have an open mind that can admit different viewpoints and ideas, and stop being afraid and stop attempting to spread fear. Learn what democracy truly is meant to be, and then work to create and sustain such democracy in Ukraine - all of Ukraine.
Don't be so quick to swallow all the negative propaganda which is coming from Russia. Are you aware that the Kremlin is paying people to post pro-Russian, anti-Ukrainian (and often anti-American) falsehoods and major distortions of fact in the comments section of many prominent Western news sources, including "The Washington Post", "The Wall Street Journal". CNN, ABC, "The New York Times", and many others? Their efforts are very obvious, given frequent misspellings, misuse of words and colloquial American English phrases, non-native English speaking grammatical mistakes, and of course, their obvious slant and deliberate disinformation.
The same can be said of the wests side - to the letter. The first casualty of war is the truth.
As for the concentration camps I say we'll see later. They're a hallmark of the west just like any other nation at war.
Yes, yes, yes.
You must read and listen only western channels, they know the truth. For example, that the Slavyansk is the Crimea.
And we are writing for money. (All those who write for money very badly speak English).
And the government of Ukraine fully democratic, no military coup was not.
The worrying thing is that all this ridiculous nonsense go through Russians like a hot knife through butter,
For a reason, it's happened before. The west have done it to Native Americans, they were called reservations. Britain did it to the Boers. Need I go on? Russians have a reason to fear it even more.
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when to westerners all these stupid stories are completely uninmaginable.
Bullchit. The people in the wests governments involved in this are not going to be held accountable in any form. If a million, 10 million die nothing will happen to them even though they're responsible for it. If you know you're above the law it opens up a whole new world. It is not unimaginable, to some it's quite desirable. There's psychopaths aplenty in power for the reasons stated above.
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Would all these things with murdering civilians, resettling population, concentration camps etc be things YOU would do if you would conquer us?
If you knew anything about history you'd not be asking that.
The whole point is that this mess is completely unnecessary.
Last edited by Rozenn; 07-06-2014 at 04:50 PM..
Reason: Rude
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That's ethnic cleansing.
