U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Happy Easter!
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 01-11-2011, 10:44 PM
 
2,526 posts, read 2,320,571 times
Reputation: 327

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
Yet you still have not quoted one scripture where Jesus gave any individual he spoke to face to face a choice or a decision to make . At least Latte Chic was bold enough to attempt to quote what she thought was the case with the account of the rich young ruler. All you have come up with is Jesus giving Nicodemus a choice to be born again, and every reasonable thinking person would tell you, naturally or spiritually you have no choice in the matter. You are as mystified as Nicodemus when it comes to understanding how one is born again.
Happy new year to you also my friend . Not sure how to send a private message so this will have to go global...LOL

May Jesus richly bless you and your's this year!

 
Old 01-11-2011, 10:56 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Wa
5,302 posts, read 5,301,111 times
Reputation: 420
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironmaw1776 View Post
So sciotamicks, i have to ask you a question ... How do you proselytize?

Do you say something like, "right now you don't really exist, you're just a figment of my imagination ... But if you believe what i tell you to you will become real".

Or something like, "right now you are not a real human, you are more like an animal, but if you believe the way i do you will become a human".

Another question, if most humans are not real, or do not really exist, then how can you truly love them?

And if you kill someone who is not a Christian or a Jew, then in Gods eyes it must not really be murder because they are not really alive, or do not really exist ... right?
My oh my Ironmaw...you are full of assumptions.

Why not just ask me the question, and leave all the presumptuous and condescending remarks out of it?
Until then....I will not regard your interests as sincere.
 
Old 01-11-2011, 11:11 PM
 
2,526 posts, read 2,320,571 times
Reputation: 327
Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
firstborn888,

You must remember that only Adam was made in God's image, and those who believe in Christ are made in His image.
Anyone outside of that, has no image.
Doesn't sound right sciota: Look here:

Gen 9:6 "Whoever sheds man's blood, By man his blood shall be shed, For in the image of God He made man.

If the image of God stopped with Adam (man) there would really be no reason to implement capital punishment upon Adam's offspring.

And yet Paul tells us that capital punishment is applicable to all, Jew and Gentiles alike:

Rom 1:14 I am debtor both to the Greeks, and to the Barbarians; both to the wise, and to the unwise.

Rom 1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
Rom 1:30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
Rom 1:31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
Rom 1:32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

Both Jews and Gentiles are created in the image of God, and if not, the term "murder" here used by Paul would be meaningless.

I also believe that Jesus will judge the ETer's for blaspheming His Name and proclaiming that the image of God (wherein He made man) will be set on fire and sent to an eternal hell. ETer's are not only unmerciful towards man but also Christ in this regard.
 
Old 01-11-2011, 11:20 PM
 
Location: Somewhere
6,370 posts, read 5,645,603 times
Reputation: 575
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
Yet you still have not quoted one scripture where Jesus gave any individual he spoke to face to face a choice or a decision to make . At least Latte Chic was bold enough to attempt to quote what she thought was the case with the account of the rich young ruler. All you have come up with is Jesus giving Nicodemus a choice to be born again, and every reasonable thinking person would tell you, naturally or spiritually you have no choice in the matter. You are as mystified as Nicodemus when it comes to understanding how one is born again.
I don't know anyone that would want to be treated with a refernce to a post instread of simply quoting a direct argument to what is presented. To exhibit the Holy Spirit is to do unto others as you would have done unto you. I know that by the Holy Spirit it would be contrary to just quote a post number and not give a very specific reference that by the least burden is assesible.
 
Old 01-11-2011, 11:23 PM
 
18,016 posts, read 8,969,119 times
Reputation: 1509
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
Yet you still have not quoted one scripture where Jesus gave any individual he spoke to face to face a choice or a decision to make . At least Latte Chic was bold enough to attempt to quote what she thought was the case with the account of the rich young ruler. All you have come up with is Jesus giving Nicodemus a choice to be born again, and every reasonable thinking person would tell you, naturally or spiritually you have no choice in the matter. You are as mystified as Nicodemus when it comes to understanding how one is born again.
The difference or distinction in the expression of born "again" has the meaning of born "anew" without the concept of repetition, thus, through the Spirit of Christ shall ALL be revived and restored to newness of life.

"For if, when we were God's enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through his life!" (Romans 5:10)


 
Old 01-11-2011, 11:29 PM
 
2,526 posts, read 2,320,571 times
Reputation: 327
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
Yet you still have not quoted one scripture where Jesus gave any individual he spoke to face to face a choice or a decision to make . At least Latte Chic was bold enough to attempt to quote what she thought was the case with the account of the rich young ruler. All you have come up with is Jesus giving Nicodemus a choice to be born again, and every reasonable thinking person would tell you, naturally or spiritually you have no choice in the matter. You are as mystified as Nicodemus when it comes to understanding how one is born again.
I don't think we'll get a scripture quote from our friend. He's still confused concerning how sinners are justified before God. His "teachers" and their doctrines have made him twice the son of gehenna as they are:

Mat 23:15 `Woe to you, Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye go round the sea and the dry land to make one proselyte, and whenever it may happen--ye make him a son of gehenna twofold more than yourselves.

Jesus told Nicodemus that everyone, from infant to old, are born of the Spirit in the exact same way. All are justified on the merits of Christ alone, and are brought to life by the will of the Spirit, apart from any choice or decision the sinner makes:

Joh 3:8 the Spirit where he willeth doth blow, and his voice thou dost hear, but thou hast not known whence he cometh, and whither he goeth; thus is every one who hath been born of the Spirit.'
 
Old 01-11-2011, 11:33 PM
 
7,374 posts, read 7,218,209 times
Reputation: 892
Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
My oh my Ironmaw...you are full of assumptions.

Why not just ask me the question, and leave all the presumptuous and condescending remarks out of it?
Until then....I will not regard your interests as sincere.
Regard my post however you will, but the truth is that you think people who are not Christians are not humans or are not really existing. It is not i who am making your doctrine sound bad, it is the doctrine itself that sounds bad.

Do you tell people of other religions that they are not real? That they do not really exist?

That is a fair question. You do believe that they don't really exist and that they are less than human(or that people who believe like you are better/more than human), and that they are not "in the image of God" like you are and those who believe the way you do.

Last edited by Ironmaw1776; 01-11-2011 at 11:54 PM..
 
Old 01-11-2011, 11:46 PM
 
20,353 posts, read 15,734,050 times
Reputation: 7497
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
Yet you still have not quoted one scripture where Jesus gave any individual he spoke to face to face a choice or a decision to make . At least Latte Chic was bold enough to attempt to quote what she thought was the case with the account of the rich young ruler. All you have come up with is Jesus giving Nicodemus a choice to be born again, and every reasonable thinking person would tell you, naturally or spiritually you have no choice in the matter. You are as mystified as Nicodemus when it comes to understanding how one is born again.
Nicodemus was given the gospel and had a choice to make.

The gospel is all about making a choice.

John 5:40 ''and you are unwilling to come to Me, that you may have life.''

John 5:43 ''I have come in My Father's name and you do not receive Me.''

John 12:48 ''He who rejects Me, and does not receive My sayings, has one who judges him; the word I spoke is what will judge him at the last day.''


Readers may refer back to posts #163, 167, 171, and 174.

Oh yes. With regard to post #289, it's perhaps borderline, I suggest you read the new sticky at the top of the forum. Try to show a little maturity. A little professionalism. A little integrity.
 
Old 01-12-2011, 12:10 AM
 
2,526 posts, read 2,320,571 times
Reputation: 327
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
The gospel is all about making a choice.

John 5:40 ''and you are unwilling to come to Me, that you may have life.''

John 5:43 ''I have come in My Father's name and you do not receive Me.''

John 12:48 ''He who rejects Me, and does not receive My sayings, has one who judges him; the word I spoke is what will judge him at the last day.''


Readers may refer back to posts #163, 167, 171, and 174.

Oh yes. With regard to post #289, it's perhaps borderline, I suggest you read the new sticky at the top of the forum. Try to show a little maturity. A little professionalism. A little integrity.
I'd like to jump in here....

Actually, there is nothing about a choice being spoken of. Jesus is telling us that those who are not born of the Spirit:

1. Are unwilling to come to Him;
2. They do not receive Him;
3. They reject Him.

Paul tells us the exact same thing here:

1Co 2:14 and the natural man doth not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for to him they are foolishness, and he is not able to know them , because spiritually they are discerned;

And why is this so? Paul tells us why:

Rom 8:7 because the mind of the flesh is enmity to God, for to the law of God it doth not subject itself,
Rom 8:8 for neither is it able; and those who are in the flesh are not able to please God.

A "free will choice for Jesus" by the natural man is not a scriptural doctrine. The whole free will concept is foreign to what Jesus taught and what Paul instructed the Church concerning. This is why the natural man must be born of the Spirit. Not only to enter the Kingdom, but to also see how this spiritual birth comes about:

Joh 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

You cannot choose what you cannot "see".
 
Old 01-12-2011, 12:15 AM
 
2,526 posts, read 2,320,571 times
Reputation: 327
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
The gospel is all about making a choice.
That's because you really don't know what the Gospel is.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Closed Thread

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top